DEMURRAGE - aka time is money...or lack therof.

Jul 28, 2016 at 02:17 PM CST + 3
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.	Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member. I was asked to pick up an 'EMERGENCY LOAD" on Tuesday. (although these folks seem to have an emergency on a daily basis according to their emails.) Per customer request they wanted my truck washed out and sitting at the loading facility overnight in order to load at 6am and run the load straight to the destination the same day (584 mile haul). Arrangements were made to be washed out and sitting there Monday night, which the driver was. Late Monday, well after office hours, my customer called to ask if instead of running it straight to destination could they change our delivery appointment time to 8a on Wednesday morning. I said that was fine, that I had a reload scheduled for Wednesday and that would still work for us. My truck arrived for his 8a unload appointment at 7:45a. He was immediately told that his load was scheduled for 4am the previous day, that he was over a day late and that he would be worked in when they could get to him. Of course we realized at that point that surely there must have been some type of clerical error because we were clearly told by the customer that he had spoken with the plant manager on Monday evening and that instead of running it right out that evening ( which apparently still would have been late) that they wanted to switch the appointment to 8am.(that's sarcasm of course for those who do not recognize it) Although my truck arrived ahead of his appointment, he was not scaled in until 8:33am. This was due to another truck being on the scale when he arrived, and they sample the trucks on the scale, and then a 2nd truck was empty and scaled out before they could get to my guy. Throughout the day I kept asking the customer when we might have some indication on a time to be unloaded. He said he was trying to get an answer. By the afternoon I was called and told that approx. 4-6 more trucks would be unloaded before they could get to us and it would likely be 8-10p before we got unloaded. My truck was FINALLY offloaded at 3:19am Thurday morning. 20 hours and 19 minutes after our SCHEDULED delivery appointment. I had of course asked the customer about demurrage the day before when we knew there was going to be a substantial wait. I had asked at that time if there was a set hourly rate for detention. I got mostly vague responses about how sometimes they are pretty good to work with us, etc. As requested by my customer, on Thurday morning I got a copy of the scale ticket from the driver and forwarded to customer. I let him know that we would add a line item for the demurrage 19.25 hours minus 2 hours ( on a scheduled appoitment) = 17.25 hours @ $50/hour. For a total of $862.50 My customer came back and said that all they will pay is $30 an hour AFTER 4 hours, except that since our truck was not scaled in until 8:33a he was considered "late" and that would push the demurrage back to 6 hours free wait time, AND they round down, so after 20 hours and 19 minutes I would actually be getting paid for only 12.5 hours. Because of the delay getting scaled and the rounding down of the time we haveended up with 7.75 hours with ZERO compensation and even the time we are getting paid for is substantialy less than it should be. Who else would show up for work and think it is ok to NOT get paid for your time? I do not understand why truck drivers are expected to wait without fair compensation. These days the profit margins have gotten tighter then ever. If I had a dollar for everytime I have been told "fuel is down" in the past year I could probably just retire now. But there seems to be no consideration for the costs in trucking that have continued to rise: A new Peterbilt currently goes for $170K and the average truck payment is around $1900 a month vs $1500 per month only 4-5 years ago. Insurance is around $850/month on the average for a used truck - up over $250 per month in the last 4 years. Tires are running about $480 to $550, a full 25% increase in just 3 years. Oil changes have increased 30% over 7 years across the board regardless of where you get them done. Combine that with a drivers rent/mortgage, utilities, car payment, etc. at home - those costs have not dropped with the cost of diesel fuel. Any one who knows me, knows that I advocate for my drivers day in and day out. Our guys are out on the road doing a harder job than I could ever imagine doing myself. It is discouraging to me and insulting to their efforts when it seems to just be "no big deal" that 20 hours and 19 minutes of wait is ony is worth $375.

Jul 28, 2016 at 02:17 PM CST

+ 3

Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

I was asked to pick up an 'EMERGENCY LOAD" on Tuesday. (although these folks seem to have an emergency on a daily basis according to their emails.) Per customer request they wanted my truck washed out and sitting at the loading facility overnight in order to load at 6am and run the load straight to the destination the same day (584 mile haul). Arrangements were made to be washed out and sitting there Monday night, which the driver was. Late Monday, well after office hours, my customer called to ask if instead of running it straight to destination could they change our delivery appointment time to 8a on Wednesday morning. I said that was fine, that I had a reload scheduled for Wednesday and that would still work for us.

My truck arrived for his 8a unload appointment at 7:45a. He was immediately told that his load was scheduled for 4am the previous day, that he was over a day late and that he would be worked in when they could get to him. Of course we realized at that point that surely there must have been some type of clerical error because we were clearly told by the customer that he had spoken with the plant manager on Monday evening and that instead of running it right out that evening ( which apparently still would have been late) that they wanted to switch the appointment to 8am.(that's sarcasm of course for those who do not recognize it)

Although my truck arrived ahead of his appointment, he was not scaled in until 8:33am. This was due to another truck being on the scale when he arrived, and they sample the trucks on the scale, and then a 2nd truck was empty and scaled out before they could get to my guy.

Throughout the day I kept asking the customer when we might have some indication on a time to be unloaded. He said he was trying to get an answer. By the afternoon I was called and told that approx. 4-6 more trucks would be unloaded before they could get to us and it would likely be 8-10p before we got unloaded.

My truck was FINALLY offloaded at 3:19am Thurday morning. 20 hours and 19 minutes after our SCHEDULED delivery appointment. I had of course asked the customer about demurrage the day before when we knew there was going to be a substantial wait. I had asked at that time if there was a set hourly rate for detention. I got mostly vague responses about how sometimes they are pretty good to work with us, etc.

As requested by my customer, on Thurday morning I got a copy of the scale ticket from the driver and forwarded to customer. I let him know that we would add a line item for the demurrage 19.25 hours minus 2 hours ( on a scheduled appoitment) = 17.25 hours @ $50/hour. For a total of $862.50

My customer came back and said that all they will pay is $30 an hour AFTER 4 hours, except that since our truck was not scaled in until 8:33a he was considered "late" and that would push the demurrage back to 6 hours free wait time, AND they round down, so after 20 hours and 19 minutes I would actually be getting paid for only 12.5 hours. Because of the delay getting scaled and the rounding down of the time we haveended up with 7.75 hours with ZERO compensation and even the time we are getting paid for is substantialy less than it should be.

Who else would show up for work and think it is ok to NOT get paid for your time? I do not understand why truck drivers are expected to wait without fair compensation. These days the profit margins have gotten tighter then ever.

If I had a dollar for everytime I have been told "fuel is down" in the past year I could probably just retire now. But there seems to be no consideration for the costs in trucking that have continued to rise:

A new Peterbilt currently goes for $170K and the average truck payment is around $1900 a month vs $1500 per month only 4-5 years ago.

Insurance is around $850/month on the average for a used truck - up over $250 per month in the last 4 years.

Tires are running about $480 to $550, a full 25% increase in just 3 years.

Oil changes have increased 30% over 7 years across the board regardless of where you get them done.

Combine that with a drivers rent/mortgage, utilities, car payment, etc. at home - those costs have not dropped with the cost of diesel fuel.

Any one who knows me, knows that I advocate for my drivers day in and day out. Our guys are out on the road doing a harder job than I could ever imagine doing myself. It is discouraging to me and insulting to their efforts when it seems to just be "no big deal" that 20 hours and 19 minutes of wait is ony is worth $375.

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 04:40 PM CST + 1
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.	Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member. I strongly agree with you on the points you made. Even though I am one of those scoundrel brokers that everyone likes to rag on, I agree with everything you said. We do the same thing here. We fight night and day to attempt to get detention for our drivers. My favorite question to the merchant or shipper is to ask them how the premium on their obama care is working out for them. That usually brings out a choir of crickets! Drivers have the same home expenses and normal human beings do. House payments, groceries, home owner or renters insurance, child care, the list goes on and on. None of those have seen a decrease. Someone said awhile back that we all need to work together or we will soon be forced to. My question is...who is hauling the cheap crap out there that only serves to encourage shippers and merchants to continue to offer these ridiculous rates. Detention is a joke and we all know it. The company paying the bill isn't going to pay a fair rate because they know they don't have to. Who among us is going to take a Cargill, Adm, or any other company to court over detention. None of us can afford the legal fees. While we are at it, what about truck ordered not used. I have had multiple instances of loads "cancelling" the past several weeks. When I ask about a truck ordered not used payment, again the cricket choir comes out. It has sucked for 30 years that I know of and it will continue to suck because not enough people would put their foot down and say enough is enough Problem is that the majority of us in this business have no recourse whatsoever. De regulation did that to us. Any one got any good ideas? Yeah I know us brokers caused all the problems and we are the ruination of the world. How bout some constructive ideas and not so much finger pointing and smoke blowing.

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 04:40 PM CST

+ 1

Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

I strongly agree with you on the points you made. Even though I am one of those scoundrel brokers that everyone likes to rag on, I agree with everything you said. We do the same thing here. We fight night and day to attempt to get detention for our drivers. My favorite question to the merchant or shipper is to ask them how the premium on their obama care is working out for them. That usually brings out a choir of crickets! Drivers have the same home expenses and normal human beings do. House payments, groceries, home owner or renters insurance, child care, the list goes on and on. None of those have seen a decrease. Someone said awhile back that we all need to work together or we will soon be forced to. My question is...who is hauling the cheap crap out there that only serves to encourage shippers and merchants to continue to offer these ridiculous rates. Detention is a joke and we all know it. The company paying the bill isn't going to pay a fair rate because they know they don't have to. Who among us is going to take a Cargill, Adm, or any other company to court over detention. None of us can afford the legal fees. While we are at it, what about truck ordered not used. I have had multiple instances of loads "cancelling" the past several weeks. When I ask about a truck ordered not used payment, again the cricket choir comes out. It has sucked for 30 years that I know of and it will continue to suck because not enough people would put their foot down and say enough is enough Problem is that the majority of us in this business have no recourse whatsoever. De regulation did that to us. Any one got any good ideas? Yeah I know us brokers caused all the problems and we are the ruination of the world. How bout some constructive ideas and not so much finger pointing and smoke blowing.

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 04:46 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.	Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member. Sorry to here this happened to you guys. Especially on a "emergency" load that had to have a truck ready and waiting and then got pushed back. 20 hours of lost revenue is flat out insane and as far as I'm concerned only paying $30 an hour for detention is nothing more than a slap in the face after you bent over backwards to get a truck there on time and the customer then dropped the ball with the appointment and communication. Arguing will probably do no good what so ever as it doesn't matter to the customer that all of our costs have gone up. If the customer has ever dealt with the railroad and they've heald up a train that could be a said argument for you. It's amazing how that works I had that conversation last week with a customer after waiting to unload for about 4 hours. It's funny how the railroad gets paid big bucks for their train being delayed but you can hold a truck up for days and nobody wants to pay for the lost time and lost revenue. It's also funny that customers who are willing to pay SOME detention always seem to want to negotiate the detention as they do the rates. As if the freight rates aren't cheap enough as it is (since fuel is the only thing we trucking companies pay for) then they decide that $50/hour is too much so well pay you what we feel is reasonable and not a penny more. Aside from this incident I hope everything else is running smoothly for you take care and I hope this works out for the better and the customer comes to their senses on the situation. Good luck with it.

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 04:46 PM CST

Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

Sorry to here this happened to you guys. Especially on a "emergency" load that had to have a truck ready and waiting and then got pushed back. 20 hours of lost revenue is flat out insane and as far as I'm concerned only paying $30 an hour for detention is nothing more than a slap in the face after you bent over backwards to get a truck there on time and the customer then dropped the ball with the appointment and communication.

Arguing will probably do no good what so ever as it doesn't matter to the customer that all of our costs have gone up. If the customer has ever dealt with the railroad and they've heald up a train that could be a said argument for you. It's amazing how that works I had that conversation last week with a customer after waiting to unload for about 4 hours. It's funny how the railroad gets paid big bucks for their train being delayed but you can hold a truck up for days and nobody wants to pay for the lost time and lost revenue. It's also funny that customers who are willing to pay SOME detention always seem to want to negotiate the detention as they do the rates. As if the freight rates aren't cheap enough as it is (since fuel is the only thing we trucking companies pay for) then they decide that $50/hour is too much so well pay you what we feel is reasonable and not a penny more.

Aside from this incident I hope everything else is running smoothly for you take care and I hope this works out for the better and the customer comes to their senses on the situation. Good luck with it.

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 04:49 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.	Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member. Hey Jason - Good to hear from you - Hope things are going well for you guys!

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 04:49 PM CST

Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

Hey Jason - Good to hear from you - Hope things are going well for you guys!

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 04:52 PM CST + 2
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.	Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member. Duane - I know brokers get a bad rap ( especially on this forum) As a small carrier GOOD brokers butter our bread every day. We are blessed to have a large volume of direct freight - but we do not have the ability to do what we do without the hard work of many good brokers. I have brokers who go to bat for us all of the time and work to get rates up. I am indebted to the ones that take a good look at my truck list every day and email or call me up and try to fill the gaps for us!

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 04:52 PM CST

+ 2

Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

Duane - I know brokers get a bad rap ( especially on this forum) As a small carrier GOOD brokers butter our bread every day. We are blessed to have a large volume of direct freight - but we do not have the ability to do what we do without the hard work of many good brokers. I have brokers who go to bat for us all of the time and work to get rates up. I am indebted to the ones that take a good look at my truck list every day and email or call me up and try to fill the gaps for us!

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 05:02 PM CST - 1
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.	Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member. Quote: "Duane - I know brokers get a bad rap ( especially on this forum) As a small carrier GOOD brokers butter our bread every day. We are blessed to have a large volume of direct freight - but we do not have the ability to do what we do without the hard work of many good brokers. I have brokers who go to bat for us all of the time and work to get rates up. I am indebted to the ones that take a good look at my truck list every day and email or call me up and try to fill the gaps for us! " I probably shouldn't have popped my cork like that but i just got off a phone call where we were going after truck ordered not used money as well as a detention situation similar to what you described. Blood pressure was a bit high for a couple minutes. I totally understand what you were trying to say and i agree wholeheartedly with it. It burns me to a crisp when one of my drivers gets in a situation. Most of the time the complaints will fall on deaf ears. I was on the phone most of the day trying to solve a problem where a customer needed a load to get to the reciever quick or they would run out of material. My driver gave it all he had to get the material there. When we got there, we were told that the reciever didn't need the material as they were full. When I asked the merchant what was going on, I finally got him to admit that he was late on a load and was catching hell for not getting it there when it should have got there. Now the battle is how to get the detention out of this guy as the reciever had made other arrangements for material and my truck is still sitting there through no fault of his. I'll dig into my pocket and pay him for his time as he should be paid. i can also guarantee that this is the last load me or my guys will ever deliver for this merchant. PS it is one of the big boys.

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 05:02 PM CST

- 1

Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

Quote: "Duane - I know brokers get a bad rap ( especially on this forum) As a small carrier GOOD brokers butter our bread every day. We are blessed to have a large volume of direct freight - but we do not have the ability to do what we do without the hard work of many good brokers. I have brokers who go to bat for us all of the time and work to get rates up. I am indebted to the ones that take a good look at my truck list every day and email or call me up and try to fill the gaps for us! "

I probably shouldn't have popped my cork like that but i just got off a phone call where we were going after truck ordered not used money as well as a detention situation similar to what you described. Blood pressure was a bit high for a couple minutes. I totally understand what you were trying to say and i agree wholeheartedly with it. It burns me to a crisp when one of my drivers gets in a situation. Most of the time the complaints will fall on deaf ears. I was on the phone most of the day trying to solve a problem where a customer needed a load to get to the reciever quick or they would run out of material. My driver gave it all he had to get the material there. When we got there, we were told that the reciever didn't need the material as they were full. When I asked the merchant what was going on, I finally got him to admit that he was late on a load and was catching hell for not getting it there when it should have got there. Now the battle is how to get the detention out of this guy as the reciever had made other arrangements for material and my truck is still sitting there through no fault of his. I'll dig into my pocket and pay him for his time as he should be paid. i can also guarantee that this is the last load me or my guys will ever deliver for this merchant. PS it is one of the big boys.

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 05:22 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.	Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member. Quote: "I strongly agree with you on the points you made. Even though I am one of those scoundrel brokers that everyone likes to rag on, I agree with everything you said. We do the same thing here. We fight night and day to attempt to get detention for our drivers. My favorite question to the merchant or shipper is to ask them how the premium on their obama care is working out for them. That usually brings out a choir of crickets! Drivers have the same home expenses and normal human beings do. House payments, groceries, home owner or renters insurance, child care, the list goes on and on. None of those have seen a decrease. Someone said awhile back that we all need to work together or we will soon be forced to. My question is...who is hauling the cheap crap out there that only serves to encourage shippers and merchants to continue to offer these ridiculous rates. Detention is a joke and we all know it. The company paying the bill isn't going to pay a fair rate because they know they don't have to. Who among us is going to take a Cargill, Adm, or any other company to court over detention. None of us can afford the legal fees. While we are at it, what about truck ordered not used. I have had multiple instances of loads "cancelling" the past several weeks. When I ask about a truck ordered not used payment, again the cricket choir comes out. It has sucked for 30 years that I know of and it will continue to suck because not enough people would put their foot down and say enough is enough Problem is that the majority of us in this business have no recourse whatsoever. De regulation did that to us. Any one got any good ideas? Yeah I know us brokers caused all the problems and we are the ruination of the world. How bout some constructive ideas and not so much finger pointing and smoke blowing." Duane, a few years ago jbhunt released that they have a shipper and receiver black book that they and other mega carriers use. If your company gets put in it then your company gets charged higher rates . They claim they don't need these customers , they only want the pod customers. Maybe we should start announcing these names on the forum and if enough mentioned then they will have no choice but to pay or do without. No one has any balls anymore. Over at the independent carrier group we have a blacklist and we use it. Just a thought.

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 05:22 PM CST

Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

Quote: "I strongly agree with you on the points you made. Even though I am one of those scoundrel brokers that everyone likes to rag on, I agree with everything you said. We do the same thing here. We fight night and day to attempt to get detention for our drivers. My favorite question to the merchant or shipper is to ask them how the premium on their obama care is working out for them. That usually brings out a choir of crickets! Drivers have the same home expenses and normal human beings do. House payments, groceries, home owner or renters insurance, child care, the list goes on and on. None of those have seen a decrease. Someone said awhile back that we all need to work together or we will soon be forced to. My question is...who is hauling the cheap crap out there that only serves to encourage shippers and merchants to continue to offer these ridiculous rates. Detention is a joke and we all know it. The company paying the bill isn't going to pay a fair rate because they know they don't have to. Who among us is going to take a Cargill, Adm, or any other company to court over detention. None of us can afford the legal fees. While we are at it, what about truck ordered not used. I have had multiple instances of loads "cancelling" the past several weeks. When I ask about a truck ordered not used payment, again the cricket choir comes out. It has sucked for 30 years that I know of and it will continue to suck because not enough people would put their foot down and say enough is enough Problem is that the majority of us in this business have no recourse whatsoever. De regulation did that to us. Any one got any good ideas? Yeah I know us brokers caused all the problems and we are the ruination of the world. How bout some constructive ideas and not so much finger pointing and smoke blowing."

Duane, a few years ago jbhunt released that they have a shipper and receiver black book that they and other mega carriers use. If your company gets put in it then your company gets charged higher rates . They claim they don't need these customers , they only want the pod customers. Maybe we should start announcing these names on the forum and if enough mentioned then they will have no choice but to pay or do without. No one has any balls anymore. Over at the independent carrier group we have a blacklist and we use it. Just a thought.

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 08:45 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.	Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member. Duane you know me. I only once lumped all brokers in a pot and have paid the price ever since. You know that you are one of my favorite people and you run a no nonsense business that I respect. I have never had the opportunity to haul for Chicoda, I've heard mostly good things about them. On any loads that I haul direct we have a load confirmation sheet. We don't move a load for anyone without that being signed, ever. Our sheet clearly states the price for truck ordered not used and detention. If the customer has a problem, we deal with it prior to ever loading for them. It mostly gets ignored until there is trouble then its "oh I didn't notice that". I have had some that asked to negotiate and we do on a case by case basis. If ELD's become industry wide there will be no choice about this. These shippers and recievers really should wake up now and start solving problems before it becomes all out war. it will be another case of be smart or the government will be forced to come in and regulate it. I agree with Jason that there should be some form of info somewhere for everyone to see how a shipper or reciever deals with getting people in and out. This subject is only going to be more important. I hope that there can be more cooperation between all sides to find an equatable solution. Art Pfluger

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 08:45 PM CST

Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

Duane you know me. I only once lumped all brokers in a pot and have paid the price ever since. You know that you are one of my favorite people and you run a no nonsense business that I respect. I have never had the opportunity to haul for Chicoda, I've heard mostly good things about them. On any loads that I haul direct we have a load confirmation sheet. We don't move a load for anyone without that being signed, ever. Our sheet clearly states the price for truck ordered not used and detention. If the customer has a problem, we deal with it prior to ever loading for them. It mostly gets ignored until there is trouble then its "oh I didn't notice that". I have had some that asked to negotiate and we do on a case by case basis. If ELD's become industry wide there will be no choice about this. These shippers and recievers really should wake up now and start solving problems before it becomes all out war. it will be another case of be smart or the government will be forced to come in and regulate it. I agree with Jason that there should be some form of info somewhere for everyone to see how a shipper or reciever deals with getting people in and out. This subject is only going to be more important. I hope that there can be more cooperation between all sides to find an equatable solution.

Art Pfluger

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 10:50 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.	Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member. Quote: "I probably shouldn't have popped my cork like that but i just got off a phone call where we were going after truck ordered not used money as well as a detention situation similar to what you described. Blood pressure was a bit high for a couple minutes. I totally understand what you were trying to say and i agree wholeheartedly with it. It burns me to a crisp when one of my drivers gets in a situation. Most of the time the complaints will fall on deaf ears. I was on the phone most of the day trying to solve a problem where a customer needed a load to get to the reciever quick or they would run out of material. My driver gave it all he had to get the material there. When we got there, we were told that the reciever didn't need the material as they were full. When I asked the merchant what was going on, I finally got him to admit that he was late on a load and was catching hell for not getting it there when it should have got there. Now the battle is how to get the detention out of this guy as the reciever had made other arrangements for material and my truck is still sitting there through no fault of his. I'll dig into my pocket and pay him for his time as he should be paid. i can also guarantee that this is the last load me or my guys will ever deliver for this merchant. PS it is one of the big boys." Pop your cork all you want! That is pretty much what I felt the need to do today. I'm mostly just a spectator on this forum and keep drama to a minimum but today was just one more of many times that while the truck is sitting with a load in the trailer I get fed all sorts of lines about demurrage, then once that load is finally off the trailer suddenly it's a different story. This wasn't a brokered load, it was hauled for the folks that sold the product to the consignee. As for my added comments regarding brokers, you are on my short list of good, hard working honest people.

Replied on Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 10:50 PM CST

Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

Quote: "I probably shouldn't have popped my cork like that but i just got off a phone call where we were going after truck ordered not used money as well as a detention situation similar to what you described. Blood pressure was a bit high for a couple minutes. I totally understand what you were trying to say and i agree wholeheartedly with it. It burns me to a crisp when one of my drivers gets in a situation. Most of the time the complaints will fall on deaf ears. I was on the phone most of the day trying to solve a problem where a customer needed a load to get to the reciever quick or they would run out of material. My driver gave it all he had to get the material there. When we got there, we were told that the reciever didn't need the material as they were full. When I asked the merchant what was going on, I finally got him to admit that he was late on a load and was catching hell for not getting it there when it should have got there. Now the battle is how to get the detention out of this guy as the reciever had made other arrangements for material and my truck is still sitting there through no fault of his. I'll dig into my pocket and pay him for his time as he should be paid. i can also guarantee that this is the last load me or my guys will ever deliver for this merchant. PS it is one of the big boys."

Pop your cork all you want! That is pretty much what I felt the need to do today. I'm mostly just a spectator on this forum and keep drama to a minimum but today was just one more of many times that while the truck is sitting with a load in the trailer I get fed all sorts of lines about demurrage, then once that load is finally off the trailer suddenly it's a different story. This wasn't a brokered load, it was hauled for the folks that sold the product to the consignee. As for my added comments regarding brokers, you are on my short list of good, hard working honest people.

Replied on Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 08:01 AM CST + 1
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.	Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member. Quote: "Duane you know me. I only once lumped all brokers in a pot and have paid the price ever since. You know that you are one of my favorite people and you run a no nonsense business that I respect. I have never had the opportunity to haul for Chicoda, I've heard mostly good things about them. On any loads that I haul direct we have a load confirmation sheet. We don't move a load for anyone without that being signed, ever. Our sheet clearly states the price for truck ordered not used and detention. If the customer has a problem, we deal with it prior to ever loading for them. It mostly gets ignored until there is trouble then its "oh I didn't notice that". I have had some that asked to negotiate and we do on a case by case basis. If ELD's become industry wide there will be no choice about this. These shippers and recievers really should wake up now and start solving problems before it becomes all out war. it will be another case of be smart or the government will be forced to come in and regulate it. I agree with Jason that there should be some form of info somewhere for everyone to see how a shipper or reciever deals with getting people in and out. This subject is only going to be more important. I hope that there can be more cooperation between all sides to find an equatable solution. Art Pfluger" We do pretty much the same thing as you do but we also have pretty much the same result. I get fed the line " We don't do that " even tho they have signed the paperwork. For many years I have operated under the premise that " if your word is no good, then your signature isn't going to be any better" For the most part we have succeeded fairly well on that theory. What I have noticed over the past several years and more in the past 6 or 7 months is that there is a definite lack of pride in getting to a job well done. I am probably as guilty as the next person in that regard because after the beating that we all have taken over the past year or so, a person tends to say the heck with it. My temper tends to get the best of me occasionally and I have ticked off a lot of people over the years because everything is pretty much black and white with me, very little room for gray areas. More and more I see people walking the gray areas. Loads get cancelled then you see them posted on some load board for 10 to 50 bucks a ton under what you were doing them for. Sad and infuriating times we live in. One bright spot tho is working with Marsha at Chicoda. I have never come across a company that has the number of quality drivers she has. I have given her loads and she has given me loads as well and it is a pleasure working with her. Marsha handled a project for me out east last year and the customer couldn't stop raving about the quality of drivers she has as well as the cleanliness of the equipment. You don't find a lot of companies that take the pride in their occupation that they do. They are just plain good people. Enough of the stump this morning. Time to get back to the business of trying to get my trucks moving. Hope everyone has a profitable day.

Replied on Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 08:01 AM CST

+ 1

Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

Quote: "Duane you know me. I only once lumped all brokers in a pot and have paid the price ever since. You know that you are one of my favorite people and you run a no nonsense business that I respect. I have never had the opportunity to haul for Chicoda, I've heard mostly good things about them. On any loads that I haul direct we have a load confirmation sheet. We don't move a load for anyone without that being signed, ever. Our sheet clearly states the price for truck ordered not used and detention. If the customer has a problem, we deal with it prior to ever loading for them. It mostly gets ignored until there is trouble then its "oh I didn't notice that". I have had some that asked to negotiate and we do on a case by case basis. If ELD's become industry wide there will be no choice about this. These shippers and recievers really should wake up now and start solving problems before it becomes all out war. it will be another case of be smart or the government will be forced to come in and regulate it. I agree with Jason that there should be some form of info somewhere for everyone to see how a shipper or reciever deals with getting people in and out. This subject is only going to be more important. I hope that there can be more cooperation between all sides to find an equatable solution. Art Pfluger"

We do pretty much the same thing as you do but we also have pretty much the same result. I get fed the line " We don't do that " even tho they have signed the paperwork. For many years I have operated under the premise that " if your word is no good, then your signature isn't going to be any better" For the most part we have succeeded fairly well on that theory. What I have noticed over the past several years and more in the past 6 or 7 months is that there is a definite lack of pride in getting to a job well done. I am probably as guilty as the next person in that regard because after the beating that we all have taken over the past year or so, a person tends to say the heck with it. My temper tends to get the best of me occasionally and I have ticked off a lot of people over the years because everything is pretty much black and white with me, very little room for gray areas. More and more I see people walking the gray areas. Loads get cancelled then you see them posted on some load board for 10 to 50 bucks a ton under what you were doing them for. Sad and infuriating times we live in. One bright spot tho is working with Marsha at Chicoda. I have never come across a company that has the number of quality drivers she has. I have given her loads and she has given me loads as well and it is a pleasure working with her. Marsha handled a project for me out east last year and the customer couldn't stop raving about the quality of drivers she has as well as the cleanliness of the equipment. You don't find a lot of companies that take the pride in their occupation that they do. They are just plain good people. Enough of the stump this morning. Time to get back to the business of trying to get my trucks moving. Hope everyone has a profitable day.

Replied on Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 10:19 AM CST + 1
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.	Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member. Check into this. http://m.trucker.com/news/your-own-terms I hope this link works. Please let me know if it doesn't.

Replied on Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 10:19 AM CST

+ 1

Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

Check into this.

http://m.trucker.com/news/your-own-terms

I hope this link works. Please let me know if it doesn't.

Replied on Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 10:27 AM CST - 1
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.	Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member. Quote: "Check into this. http://m.trucker.com/news/your-own-terms I hope this link works. Please let me know if it doesn't. " IT WORKED FINE. I KNEW THERE WERE PROVISIONS FOR THIS, JUST COULDN'T FIND THEM. THANKS

Replied on Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 10:27 AM CST

- 1

Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

Quote: "Check into this. http://m.trucker.com/news/your-own-terms I hope this link works. Please let me know if it doesn't. "

IT WORKED FINE. I KNEW THERE WERE PROVISIONS FOR THIS, JUST COULDN'T FIND THEM. THANKS

Replied on Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 11:50 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.	Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member. Quote: "IT WORKED FINE. I KNEW THERE WERE PROVISIONS FOR THIS, JUST COULDN'T FIND THEM. THANKS " Duanne also if you remember take note of the article stating that with ELD these come into play that it would be very wise to have this tariff. It will help us get paid because we're not able to run like we are today we're going to have toget paid for our time rather than by weight. Ooida help me years ago get set up with my tariff.

Replied on Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 11:50 AM CST

Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

Quote: "IT WORKED FINE. I KNEW THERE WERE PROVISIONS FOR THIS, JUST COULDN'T FIND THEM. THANKS "

Duanne also if you remember take note of the article stating that with ELD these come into play that it would be very wise to have this tariff. It will help us get paid because we're not able to run like we are today we're going to have toget paid for our time rather than by weight. Ooida help me years ago get set up with my tariff.