PERPETUATING BAD DRIVERS - Bulk Trucking Forum & Discussion Board & Bulkloads.com

{ "forumId": 24353, "postTypeId": 1, "postType": "Forum", "forumTitle": "PERPETUATING BAD DRIVERS", "forumContent": "Ok if I terminate a driver for damaging equipment or damaging or losing product or some real blatant thing that we would all agree that is a termination offense, how do we get this person out of the system? If some one contacts me about a past employee and I tell it my way from my point of view that person will probably suit my a&^ off and that isn't the result that I want. But if all I am allowed to say is I would not rehire him, to me that is to ambiguous an answer and I see these people being hired and fired and it is a continous circle. I understand that sometimes we all let people go because of personality disagreements and we can't run someone out of the industry because they anoy us, but to allow people to continue on with out a trail as to the distruction they have caused isn't right either. For Christmas I get to rebuild a Cat motor because a driver left the fill plug off and ran the motor out of Oil. I don't see a way to warn the next employer with out a liabilty on my part. I don't want that person to be passed on to someone else and I don't want that person ending up here. So what is the answer in our politically correct society? I'm tired of these recyled idiots. If I chew on them they quit, thank god, because I hurt their feelings. When I started I never had a real problem with getting my butt chewed if I screwed up, that was how we learned. People today want a check and have no pride in becoming a real driver.", "forumContentHtml": "Ok if I terminate a driver for damaging equipment or damaging or losing product or some real blatant thing that we would all agree that is a termination offense, how do we get this person out of the system? If some one contacts me about a past employee and I tell it my way from my point of view that person will probably suit my a&^ off and that isn't the result that I want. But if all I am allowed to say is I would not rehire him, to me that is to ambiguous an answer and I see these people being hired and fired and it is a continous circle. I understand that sometimes we all let people go because of personality disagreements and we can't run someone out of the industry because they anoy us, but to allow people to continue on with out a trail as to the distruction they have caused isn't right either. For Christmas I get to rebuild a Cat motor because a driver left the fill plug off and ran the motor out of Oil. I don't see a way to warn the next employer with out a liabilty on my part. I don't want that person to be passed on to someone else and I don't want that person ending up here. So what is the answer in our politically correct society? I'm tired of these recyled idiots. If I chew on them they quit, thank god, because I hurt their feelings. When I started I never had a real problem with getting my butt chewed if I screwed up, that was how we learned. People today want a check and have no pride in becoming a real driver.", "thumbUrl": "", "dateAdded": "2013-12-24T05:36:19Z", "lastPost": "2013-12-24T05:36:19Z", "views": 2468, "likes": 1, "dislikes": 0, "messageCount": 16, "premiumOnly": 0, "isfeatured": 0, "showInDays": -100, "showDate": "", "forumLink": "", "youtubeVideoId": "", "approved": 1, "active": 1, "alias": "perpetuating-bad-drivers", "forumUrl": "https://www.bulkloads.com/forum/perpetuating-bad-drivers/", "userId": 3266, "firstName": "ROSE", "lastName": "PFLUGER", "companyName": "ROAD WARRIORS TRANSPORTATION INC", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "MORRISTOWN", "state": "AZ", "userCommentCount": 804, "userLikes": 10, "replies": [ { "replyId": 24207, "content": "I posted this Art Pfluger, not Rose", "contentHtml": "I posted this\r\nArt Pfluger, not Rose", "parentReplyId": null, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2010-12-05", "dateAdded": "2013-12-24T05:38:13Z", "likes": 0, "dislikes": 0, "approved": 1, "userId": 3266, "firstName": "ROSE", "lastName": "PFLUGER", "companyName": "ROAD WARRIORS TRANSPORTATION INC", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "MORRISTOWN", "state": "AZ", "userCommentCount": 804, "userLikes": 10, "userDislikes": 4, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 }, { "replyId": 24208, "content": "Art, Welcome to the ME world. I want you to pay ME top dollar. ME want to do the least work possible. Me do not want to do a proper pre trip. Me should not be held accountable for any damage I do. I have avoided most of these problems by screening my dirvers. I do road tests, I check with former employers, and tell them anything said is between him and I..and it always has been, I make sure if I do not hire the guy, I use another reason. If I feel someone is a danger, I would call the DOT. Last, you cannot be sued if what you state is fact, and is documented. I document any and every issue with a driver, including bad behavior with written notices, along with the date. I also document any freight losses and equipment damage. I also take pictures. You are well within your rights to be honest to another employer,and I don't think I could sleep at night if I did not let someone know trouble was heading their way.", "contentHtml": "Art,\r\n\r\nWelcome to the ME world. I want you to pay ME top dollar. ME want to do the least work possible. Me do not want to do a proper pre trip. Me should not be held accountable for any damage I do.\r\n\r\nI have avoided most of these problems by screening my dirvers. I do road tests, I check with former employers, and tell them anything said is between him and I..and it always has been, I make sure if I do not hire the guy, I use another reason.\r\n\r\nIf I feel someone is a danger, I would call the DOT. \r\n\r\nLast, you cannot be sued if what you state is fact, and is documented. I document any and every issue with a driver, including bad behavior with written notices, along with the date. I also document any freight losses and equipment damage. I also take pictures.\r\n\r\nYou are well within your rights to be honest to another employer,and I don't think I could sleep at night if I did not let someone know trouble was heading their way.", "parentReplyId": null, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2013-11-18", "dateAdded": "2013-12-24T07:41:32Z", "likes": 1, "dislikes": 0, "approved": 1, "userId": 12725, "firstName": "GREG", "lastName": "BUSCH", "companyName": "PACWEST BULK", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "BREMERTON", "state": "WA", "userCommentCount": 11, "userLikes": 0, "userDislikes": 0, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 }, { "replyId": 24209, "content": "Art, After reading my post, I wanted to clarify that technicaly I am sure some lawyer might be slimey enough for telling the truth, but I doubt it would ever make it to Court. Likely, you would just be left off the drivers next application as an employer.", "contentHtml": "Art,\r\n\r\nAfter reading my post, I wanted to clarify that technicaly I am sure some lawyer might be slimey enough for telling the truth, but I doubt it would ever make it to Court. Likely, you would just be left off the drivers next application as an employer.", "parentReplyId": null, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2013-11-18", "dateAdded": "2013-12-24T07:45:06Z", "likes": 0, "dislikes": 0, "approved": 1, "userId": 12725, "firstName": "GREG", "lastName": "BUSCH", "companyName": "PACWEST BULK", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "BREMERTON", "state": "WA", "userCommentCount": 11, "userLikes": 0, "userDislikes": 0, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 }, { "replyId": 28679, "content": "If you can say anything other than the driver is ok then your states laws must be very different than most. The worst that can be said is that the employee was ok. Would you rehire. Maybe a hell no could give the best feeling of the position . But nothing in a negative form. At least now you can get a clue out of the drivers CSA score with their actions there. Now if a co worker came up to you.. And says, I know that guy . They can say what ever they think about it. If the good driver is worth their salt, and have to work around these idiots, they will pick up things that you can't be told by other employers.. Maybe send all your new drivers for a day or two with another truck just to play it out.. Showing the new guy where things are and have them watch the new guy. Ones thoughts of another... Can't end up in court.", "contentHtml": "If you can say anything other than the driver is ok then your states laws must be very different than most. The worst that can be said is that the employee was ok. Would you rehire. Maybe a hell no could give the best feeling of the position . But nothing in a negative form. At least now you can get a clue out of the drivers CSA score with their actions there. Now if a co worker came up to you.. And says, I know that guy . They can say what ever they think about it. If the good driver is worth their salt, and have to work around these idiots, they will pick up things that you can't be told by other employers.. Maybe send all your new drivers for a day or two with another truck just to play it out.. Showing the new guy where things are and have them watch the new guy. Ones thoughts of another... Can't end up in court.", "parentReplyId": 24208, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2010-11-12", "dateAdded": "2013-12-24T18:47:35Z", "likes": 0, "dislikes": 0, "approved": 1, "userId": 3078, "firstName": "JEFF", "lastName": "PEARSON", "companyName": "C & R TRUCKING INC", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "PAYSON", "state": "UT", "userCommentCount": 927, "userLikes": 225, "userDislikes": 94, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 }, { "replyId": 24210, "content": "I've always said what I thought, and still do. When I was in my 20's we had our truck leased to Landstar and hired drivers. Hired one from around the college town where I lived at the time He interviewed well so he was awarded the job. The first run out it was apparent he had a temper among other things. He lasted a short time, got upset with an agent and dead-headed 1000+ miles home from New Jersey to KS without communication with me. We parted company quick after he got home and announced what he'd done. (He had the truck cleaned out on his own.) A short time later I receive a call from a carrier performing a background check on him. I politely answer the questions and tell the interviewer of the few good qualities he had. (which was true)He kept the truck up and his paperwork was always precise. Then I told her the negatives...temper, lack of respect for agents, domineering personality, etc. Every time the interviewer exclaimed \"oh my god,\" as they had him in oreientation as we were speaking. My final comment to her was \"I wouldn't piss on the Son of a B&^$# if he caught fire!\" To that she replied \"Oh my God!\" I told her I was sorry, but she asked my opinion, and that maybe they should perform a background check BEFORE they awarded him a job and that was the truth. She thanked me for my time. I never had any repurcussions for my actions and that was over 10 years ago. I'm sure things have change since then. I did learn early in my career, that if you have an employee that tears up equipment or in otherwise costs you money....you leagally have to pay them what is owed them, and cannot deduct it from their wages. You can sue them for damages, but you are required to pay them what they are owed. It was after this experience, I quit trying to run a truck OTR, and started driving it local myself. It's also why I don't have a large fleet.....finding good drivers is tough. I've had far better luck now that I'm running local with the grain trailers. I run one, my uncle runs my second truck. My parents bought a truck for a write-off/investment and hired an older gentleman to drive. Any expansion beyond that I use owner/operators as I don't want the hassle of drivers.", "contentHtml": "I've always said what I thought, and still do. When I was in my 20's we had our truck leased to Landstar and hired drivers. Hired one from around the college town where I lived at the time He interviewed well so he was awarded the job. The first run out it was apparent he had a temper among other things. He lasted a short time, got upset with an agent and dead-headed 1000+ miles home from New Jersey to KS without communication with me. We parted company quick after he got home and announced what he'd done. (He had the truck cleaned out on his own.) A short time later I receive a call from a carrier performing a background check on him. I politely answer the questions and tell the interviewer of the few good qualities he had. (which was true)He kept the truck up and his paperwork was always precise. Then I told her the negatives...temper, lack of respect for agents, domineering personality, etc. Every time the interviewer exclaimed \"oh my god,\" as they had him in oreientation as we were speaking. My final comment to her was \"I wouldn't piss on the Son of a B&^$# if he caught fire!\" To that she replied \"Oh my God!\" I told her I was sorry, but she asked my opinion, and that maybe they should perform a background check BEFORE they awarded him a job and that was the truth. She thanked me for my time. I never had any repurcussions for my actions and that was over 10 years ago. I'm sure things have change since then. I did learn early in my career, that if you have an employee that tears up equipment or in otherwise costs you money....you leagally have to pay them what is owed them, and cannot deduct it from their wages. You can sue them for damages, but you are required to pay them what they are owed. It was after this experience, I quit trying to run a truck OTR, and started driving it local myself. It's also why I don't have a large fleet.....finding good drivers is tough. I've had far better luck now that I'm running local with the grain trailers. I run one, my uncle runs my second truck. My parents bought a truck for a write-off/investment and hired an older gentleman to drive. Any expansion beyond that I use owner/operators as I don't want the hassle of drivers.", "parentReplyId": null, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2010-07-28", "dateAdded": "2013-12-25T11:13:10Z", "likes": 0, "dislikes": 0, "approved": 1, "userId": 2180, "firstName": "TRENT", "lastName": "MCCAIN", "companyName": "MCCAIN ENTERPRISES LLC", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "COLBY", "state": "KS", "userCommentCount": 62, "userLikes": 8, "userDislikes": 0, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 }, { "replyId": 24211, "content": "I have had drivers that I think I could tell someone the truth about and they would sit back and take it, but most won't, so it becomes difficult to know what to do. I had one that told me that all he wanted was to get fired so he could collect unemployment, that was after he did $30,000 in uninsurable damages. In our state you can legally withold wages if you go about it correctly. If I wait to hire a driver until I get a response from a past employer, most of the time, the new guy might wait forever. There isn't an easy answer in our lawyer happy society, but there needs to be. If we could all communicate honestly, even with the big carriers, we could get a lot of these guys out of the system. That would do a lot more than EOBR'S and a lot of the other DOT crap. Art Pfluger", "contentHtml": "I have had drivers that I think I could tell someone the truth about and they would sit back and take it, but most won't, so it becomes difficult to know what to do. I had one that told me that all he wanted was to get fired so he could collect unemployment, that was after he did $30,000 in uninsurable damages. In our state you can legally withold wages if you go about it correctly. If I wait to hire a driver until I get a response from a past employer, most of the time, the new guy might wait forever. There isn't an easy answer in our lawyer happy society, but there needs to be. If we could all communicate honestly, even with the big carriers, we could get a lot of these guys out of the system. That would do a lot more than EOBR'S and a lot of the other DOT crap.\r\n\r\nArt Pfluger", "parentReplyId": null, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2010-12-05", "dateAdded": "2013-12-25T19:59:12Z", "likes": 0, "dislikes": 0, "approved": 1, "userId": 3266, "firstName": "ROSE", "lastName": "PFLUGER", "companyName": "ROAD WARRIORS TRANSPORTATION INC", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "MORRISTOWN", "state": "AZ", "userCommentCount": 804, "userLikes": 10, "userDislikes": 4, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 }, { "replyId": 24212, "content": "Agree some of these New drivers and I am still wet behind the ears I am 32 years old. So I am still young person but I have rode with my uncle back in the day when I was 14-18 how I knew I wanted to become Truck driver. I tell you like other People have said its hard to find drivers I am not Owner Operator but I act like I am when Driving somones Equipment I treat it like its my own. I fill out Personal Paper work regular notebook and write down every piece of equipment dings dents and what not. If I notice something I write it down if its something major I call the boss. Minor Repairs I can do Lights oil windshield washer fluid adjusting the breaks and airing up the tires and actually checking 100% of the tires everyday. At end of the week I hand in my Paper what I found wrong with quotations marks on what needs fixed soon and what can wait till needed. These new drivers are steering wheel holders. I seen a van driver wont name names but driving down with top part of door not latched. I have seen drivers driving with a blown tire on trailer they pull into a rest area and point it out to them oh I knew I am going right up the road it can wait.", "contentHtml": "Agree some of these New drivers and I am still wet behind the ears I am 32 years old. So I am still young person but I have rode with my uncle back in the day when I was 14-18 how I knew I wanted to become Truck driver. I tell you like other People have said its hard to find drivers I am not Owner Operator but I act like I am when Driving somones Equipment I treat it like its my own. I fill out Personal Paper work regular notebook and write down every piece of equipment dings dents and what not. If I notice something I write it down if its something major I call the boss. Minor Repairs I can do Lights oil windshield washer fluid adjusting the breaks and airing up the tires and actually checking 100% of the tires everyday. At end of the week I hand in my Paper what I found wrong with quotations marks on what needs fixed soon and what can wait till needed. These new drivers are steering wheel holders. I seen a van driver wont name names but driving down with top part of door not latched. I have seen drivers driving with a blown tire on trailer they pull into a rest area and point it out to them oh I knew I am going right up the road it can wait.", "parentReplyId": null, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2011-05-24", "dateAdded": "2013-12-25T22:14:13Z", "likes": 1, "dislikes": 0, "approved": 1, "userId": 4565, "firstName": "KEVIN", "lastName": "HOCKENBERRY", "companyName": "KEVIN", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "PONTIAC", "state": "IL", "userCommentCount": 13, "userLikes": 8, "userDislikes": 2, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 }, { "replyId": 28680, "content": "YOUR DOING THINGS RIGHT AND YOUR HARD WORK AND HOMEWORK YOU DO IS GOING TO PAY OFF FOR YOU SOME DAY IF NOT SOON. IF YOU CAN TRY AND ASK YOUR BOSS FOR EXPENSE RECORDS ON THE TRUCK EXAMPLE HOW FAR YOU GET ON A SET OF TIRES HOW MANY OVERHEADS WERE DONE ON THE MOTOR, HOW FAR YOU WENT ON A SET OF BRAKE LININGS, SCAMS DRUMS, THIS WILL HELP YOU TO PREPARE AND MOVE UP SOMEDAY.", "contentHtml": "YOUR DOING THINGS RIGHT AND YOUR HARD WORK AND HOMEWORK YOU DO IS GOING TO PAY OFF FOR YOU SOME DAY IF NOT SOON. IF YOU CAN TRY AND ASK YOUR BOSS FOR EXPENSE RECORDS ON THE TRUCK EXAMPLE HOW FAR YOU GET ON A SET OF TIRES HOW MANY OVERHEADS WERE DONE ON THE MOTOR, HOW FAR YOU WENT ON A SET OF BRAKE LININGS, SCAMS DRUMS, THIS WILL HELP YOU TO PREPARE AND MOVE UP SOMEDAY.", "parentReplyId": 24212, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2010-05-04", "dateAdded": "2013-12-26T20:33:02Z", "likes": 0, "dislikes": 0, "approved": 1, "userId": 1047, "firstName": "CHRISTOPHER", "lastName": "STIER", "companyName": "STIER FARMS INCORPORATED", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "GRAND MEADOW", "state": "MN", "userCommentCount": 236, "userLikes": 2, "userDislikes": 1, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 }, { "replyId": 24213, "content": "Mr.Peck I had specifically told the driver that this was a problem with these motors and this unit especially. The dispatcher warned him every morning to be aware of the problem. He had 2 years with CRST and 1 year with Anderson out of St.Cloud. When the truck ran out of oil and the computer shut it down he then ran over road debris on the shoulder and trashed a brand new steer tire. It cost $1200 to get a road call and get the truck moving again. If the driver would have had some, ANY, remorse we might have worked something out, but we decided to go seperate ways. At my shop there is a difference between an accident, a mistake and negligence. My problem is I have no way of warning the next company of his behavior and therefore we perputuate a nother person that, in my opinion, doesn't belong on the road. FMCSA wants to implement EOBR's when they would solve more problems mandating a system that gets guys like this out of the system. Honestly few emplyers contact us about a past driver we usually hear thru the grapevine who went where. Personally the ones that I have spoke with only ask will you rehire this person, you say no and they hire him anyway. The big companies we contact want usually get info back after the person has been here a couple of months and none of them will give info over the phone so that you could get it time to make a good decision. There are things that are broken in our industry, I just think that FMCSA attacks the wrong things and mostly in the wrong way. Art Pfluger", "contentHtml": "Mr.Peck I had specifically told the driver that this was a problem with these motors and this unit especially. The dispatcher warned him every morning to be aware of the problem. He had 2 years with CRST and 1 year with Anderson out of St.Cloud. When the truck ran out of oil and the computer shut it down he then ran over road debris on the shoulder and trashed a brand new steer tire. It cost $1200 to get a road call and get the truck moving again. If the driver would have had some, ANY, remorse we might have worked something out, but we decided to go seperate ways. At my shop there is a difference between an accident, a mistake and negligence. My problem is I have no way of warning the next company of his behavior and therefore we perputuate a nother person that, in my opinion, doesn't belong on the road. FMCSA wants to implement EOBR's when they would solve more problems mandating a system that gets guys like this out of the system. Honestly few emplyers contact us about a past driver we usually hear thru the grapevine who went where. Personally the ones that I have spoke with only ask will you rehire this person, you say no and they hire him anyway. The big companies we contact want usually get info back after the person has been here a couple of months and none of them will give info over the phone so that you could get it time to make a good decision. There are things that are broken in our industry, I just think that FMCSA attacks the wrong things and mostly in the wrong way.\r\n\r\nArt Pfluger", "parentReplyId": null, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2010-12-05", "dateAdded": "2013-12-27T01:39:11Z", "likes": 0, "dislikes": 0, "approved": 1, "userId": 3266, "firstName": "ROSE", "lastName": "PFLUGER", "companyName": "ROAD WARRIORS TRANSPORTATION INC", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "MORRISTOWN", "state": "AZ", "userCommentCount": 804, "userLikes": 10, "userDislikes": 4, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 }, { "replyId": 24214, "content": "Art, as long as you just keep to the truth you will no get into trouble for slander or liable. Had a driver leave food in the fridge and there were dried up maggots in there when he turned the truck in. The next carrier called and I just did not tell about the incident, the driver did the same thing to his brand new Pete. He called me back after letting the driver go and informed me of our responsibility to let each other know about the dirt-bag drivers in the world. Three carriers have called me about the same driver since and I always tell them I would never hire this driver back because he left the truck in a total state of disrepair and left about two months of spoiled food in the refrigerator upon him turning the truck in. That driver now works for a local company, driving a 95 Freightliner that according to the carrier is the worst truck in his fleet. He said the reason he put him in that truck is because it was already trashed and that is where trashy drivers belong. If you remember when we talked I suggested that you make everybody to include yourself 1099 sub-contractors. This is one of the many reasons why, the legal ramifications for what you say about sub-contractors are far less then employee's. I have not had employee's legally for over 10 years. Sub-Contractors can not successfully come after you if you only stay to the truth of the matter. Employee's on the other hand only need to get a good attorney that can make it appear as if you are trying to blacklist them. As far as your driver situation is concerned, I advise that you put down in the \"other column\" these words, Driver failed to perform proper pre-trips and in-trip inspections of the equipment. If the other carrier can not read between the lines then it is on them. Stay away from personal opinions and feelings just keep it professional and all will be fine. By the way these driver's typically will not know what you are saying unless the carrier is a dirt-bag as well.", "contentHtml": "Art, as long as you just keep to the truth you will no get into trouble for slander or liable. Had a driver leave food in the fridge and there were dried up maggots in there when he turned the truck in. The next carrier called and I just did not tell about the incident, the driver did the same thing to his brand new Pete. He called me back after letting the driver go and informed me of our responsibility to let each other know about the dirt-bag drivers in the world. Three carriers have called me about the same driver since and I always tell them I would never hire this driver back because he left the truck in a total state of disrepair and left about two months of spoiled food in the refrigerator upon him turning the truck in. That driver now works for a local company, driving a 95 Freightliner that according to the carrier is the worst truck in his fleet. He said the reason he put him in that truck is because it was already trashed and that is where trashy drivers belong. If you remember when we talked I suggested that you make everybody to include yourself 1099 sub-contractors. This is one of the many reasons why, the legal ramifications for what you say about sub-contractors are far less then employee's. I have not had employee's legally for over 10 years. Sub-Contractors can not successfully come after you if you only stay to the truth of the matter. Employee's on the other hand only need to get a good attorney that can make it appear as if you are trying to blacklist them. As far as your driver situation is concerned, I advise that you put down in the \"other column\" these words, Driver failed to perform proper pre-trips and in-trip inspections of the equipment. If the other carrier can not read between the lines then it is on them. Stay away from personal opinions and feelings just keep it professional and all will be fine. By the way these driver's typically will not know what you are saying unless the carrier is a dirt-bag as well.", "parentReplyId": null, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2013-06-26", "dateAdded": "2013-12-28T16:46:23Z", "likes": 0, "dislikes": 1, "approved": 1, "userId": 11426, "firstName": "ALFRED", "lastName": "JORDAN", "companyName": "POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC ", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "PECULIAR", "state": "MO", "userCommentCount": 1182, "userLikes": 206, "userDislikes": 6, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 }, { "replyId": 28681, "content": "How can you as a owner of trucks not have employees?", "contentHtml": "How can you as a owner of trucks not have employees?", "parentReplyId": 24214, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2010-12-18", "dateAdded": "2013-12-31T03:12:08Z", "likes": 0, "dislikes": 0, "approved": 1, "userId": 3398, "firstName": "DAVID", "lastName": "HAYES", "companyName": "ROSS BENNETT TRUCKING INC", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "Galena", "state": "KS", "userCommentCount": 236, "userLikes": 105, "userDislikes": 112, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 }, { "replyId": 29060, "content": "I don't think you can. Years ago I had my first truck leased with Landstar with the above mentioned driver. At that time I could get by with the \"contract labor\" The reasoning was, that I let the driver have control, he took the truck, called the agents and kept himself busy, the only time I was involved was to write checks. When I started my company hauling grain, I wanted to treat employees the same, and was advised by several that I couldn't. This was based on the fact that we were in constant communication with the drivers, and they \"took orders\" from me. I found the loads, I told them where, when , and how to go. Basically I had control. So all my drivers are on the payroll, and I'm responsible for taking taxes out etc. So unless I've been informed incorrect, in my current situation my drivers can't be considered \"contract labor.\" If anything this keeps us out of trouble if we were ever to be audited.", "contentHtml": "I don't think you can. Years ago I had my first truck leased with Landstar with the above mentioned driver. At that time I could get by with the \"contract labor\" The reasoning was, that I let the driver have control, he took the truck, called the agents and kept himself busy, the only time I was involved was to write checks. When I started my company hauling grain, I wanted to treat employees the same, and was advised by several that I couldn't. This was based on the fact that we were in constant communication with the drivers, and they \"took orders\" from me. I found the loads, I told them where, when , and how to go. Basically I had control. So all my drivers are on the payroll, and I'm responsible for taking taxes out etc. So unless I've been informed incorrect, in my current situation my drivers can't be considered \"contract labor.\" If anything this keeps us out of trouble if we were ever to be audited.", "parentReplyId": 28681, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2010-07-28", "dateAdded": "2013-12-31T03:48:56Z", "likes": 0, "dislikes": 0, "approved": 1, "userId": 2180, "firstName": "TRENT", "lastName": "MCCAIN", "companyName": "MCCAIN ENTERPRISES LLC", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "COLBY", "state": "KS", "userCommentCount": 62, "userLikes": 8, "userDislikes": 0, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 }, { "replyId": 29190, "content": "That has been my understanding as well. The ones that I have heard about using their drivers as contract labor are doing it for the purpose of not having to pay taxes, unemployment and work comp on their drivers.", "contentHtml": "That has been my understanding as well. The ones that I have heard about using their drivers as contract labor are doing it for the purpose of not having to pay taxes, unemployment and work comp on their drivers.", "parentReplyId": 29060, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2010-12-18", "dateAdded": "2013-12-31T18:23:07Z", "likes": 0, "dislikes": 0, "approved": 1, "userId": 3398, "firstName": "DAVID", "lastName": "HAYES", "companyName": "ROSS BENNETT TRUCKING INC", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "Galena", "state": "KS", "userCommentCount": 236, "userLikes": 105, "userDislikes": 112, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 }, { "replyId": 24215, "content": "I rent the equipment to them for a small weekly fee. They still call the shots as to the routes they run the loads, where and when they fuel, time off, etc. I am no different with them then I am with our owner/operators they just don't get the larger percentage. They have a revenue strike that they must meet each month or we will be looking for another sub-contractor to rent/lease the equipment to. This all meets the IRS guidelines for sub-contractors. Like I said I have not had employees for a long time. Either in Construction or Trucking. If you need more information feel free to call me at 816-853-2301.", "contentHtml": "I rent the equipment to them for a small weekly fee. They still call the shots as to the routes they run the loads, where and when they fuel, time off, etc. I am no different with them then I am with our owner/operators they just don't get the larger percentage. They have a revenue strike that they must meet each month or we will be looking for another sub-contractor to rent/lease the equipment to. This all meets the IRS guidelines for sub-contractors. Like I said I have not had employees for a long time. Either in Construction or Trucking. If you need more information feel free to call me at 816-853-2301.", "parentReplyId": null, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2013-06-26", "dateAdded": "2014-01-04T00:22:33Z", "likes": 0, "dislikes": 0, "approved": 1, "userId": 11426, "firstName": "ALFRED", "lastName": "JORDAN", "companyName": "POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC ", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "PECULIAR", "state": "MO", "userCommentCount": 1182, "userLikes": 206, "userDislikes": 6, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 }, { "replyId": 24216, "content": "Well, like it or not this is the future. Nearly 30 years back when I first started driving it was almost impossible to get a driving job, unlees you had a relative in the business. Back then you couldn't get a job interview unless you had about 5 years otr experiance, and you couldn't get the experiance without the job. Basically a catch 22. Most companies could be very picky because the revolving door effect hadn't happened yet. Truck driving was a fun and cool job back then, and most people treated a driver with respect. Truck drivers generally wore polished cowboy boots, western shirts and stetson hats, and were well groomed, clean shaven and actually had time to stop along the way at a truckstop and take a bath and have good cooked meal at a truckstop with a real restaurant, because we didn't have that stupid 14 hour rule to contend with. Well I guess that wasn't good enough for some folks out there, because uncle sam decided they were gonna clean up the industry, and get rid of all the rifraff out there with their new \"CDL\"program. And of course they came to the logical conclusion that we must all be on drugs, Because we loved our jobs too darn much! Yep we were all out of control, and something had to be done! Well, that worked out real well now didn't it. Intead of having happy people who love their job and fear being fired, we now have PROFESSIONAL STEERING WHEEL HOLDERS who veiw getting fired or loosing their license as a reward!!! YEP, what could possibly go wrong when you have experts and professionals running stuff, instead of the people who actually operate the equipment? BUT HEY THE BIG FLEETS got their cheap labor. I can't wait to see where CSA takes us.\n", "contentHtml": "Well, like it or not this is the future. Nearly 30 years back when I first started driving it was almost impossible to get a driving job, unlees you had a relative in the business. Back then you couldn't get a job interview unless you had about 5 years otr experiance, and you couldn't get the experiance without the job. Basically a catch 22. Most companies could be very picky because the revolving door effect hadn't happened yet. Truck driving was a fun and cool job back then, and most people treated a driver with respect. Truck drivers generally wore polished cowboy boots, western shirts and stetson hats, and were well groomed, clean shaven and actually had time to stop along the way at a truckstop and take a bath and have good cooked meal at a truckstop with a real restaurant, because we didn't have that stupid 14 hour rule to contend with. Well I guess that wasn't good enough for some folks out there, because uncle sam decided they were gonna clean up the industry, and get rid of all the rifraff out there with their new "CDL"program. And of course they came to the logical conclusion that we must all be on drugs, Because we loved our jobs too darn much! Yep we were all out of control, and something had to be done! Well, that worked out real well now didn't it. Intead of having happy people who love their job and fear being fired, we now have PROFESSIONAL STEERING WHEEL HOLDERS who veiw getting fired or loosing their license as a reward!!! YEP, what could possibly go wrong when you have experts and professionals running stuff, instead of the people who actually operate the equipment? BUT HEY THE BIG FLEETS got their cheap labor. I can't wait to see where CSA takes us.<br />", "parentReplyId": null, "thumbUrl": "", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "signUpDate": "2011-09-17", "dateAdded": "2014-01-31T04:26:29Z", "likes": 0, "dislikes": 0, "approved": 1, "userId": 5383, "firstName": "Dave", "lastName": "Winters", "companyName": "DWT TRUCKING", "email": "[email protected]", "city": "Clearwater", "state": "MN", "userCommentCount": 1292, "userLikes": 490, "userDislikes": 175, "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0 } ], "userDislikes": 4, "signUpDate": "2010-12-05", "avatarThumbUrl": "https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.bulkloads.com/user_files/profile/thumbs/default.png", "links": [], "files": [], "iLike": 0, "iDislike": 0, "iSubscribe": 0 }

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PERPETUATING BAD DRIVERS

Posted on Tue, Dec 24, 2013 at 12:36 AM CST in MORRISTOWN, AZ

PERPETUATING BAD DRIVERS

Ok if I terminate a driver for damaging equipment or damaging or losing product or some real blatant thing that we would all agree that is a termination offense, how do we get this person out of the system? If some one contacts me about a past employee and I tell it my way from my point of view that person will probably suit my a&^ off and that isn't the result that I want. But if all I am allowed to say is I would not rehire him, to me that is to ambiguous an answer and I see these people being hired and fired and it is a continous circle. I understand that sometimes we all let people go because of personality disagreements and we can't run someone out of the industry because they anoy us, but to allow people to continue on with out a trail as to the distruction they have caused isn't right either. For Christmas I get to rebuild a Cat motor because a driver left the fill plug off and ran the motor out of Oil. I don't see a way to warn the next employer with out a liabilty on my part. I don't want that person to be passed on to someone else and I don't want that person ending up here. So what is the answer in our politically correct society? I'm tired of these recyled idiots. If I chew on them they quit, thank god, because I hurt their feelings. When I started I never had a real problem with getting my butt chewed if I screwed up, that was how we learned. People today want a check and have no pride in becoming a real driver.

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PERPETUATING BAD DRIVERS

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