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FMCSA Announces Electronic Logs Mandate

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Dec 10, 2015 at 04:41 PM CST + 3 - 7
HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC Wendell, MN 108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -	HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN Added expense to an already taxed independent driver - this sucks! By early December 2017, an estimated 3 million commercial drivers will have thrown out their paper logbooks. A long-anticipated rule requiring electronic logging devices for truck and bus driver hours of service was announced Thursday morning. “Since 1938, complex, on-duty/off-duty logs for truck and bus drivers were made with pencil and paper, virtually impossible to verify,” said U.S. Transportation Secretary Anthony Foxx. “This automated technology not only brings logging records into the modern age, it also allows roadside safety inspectors to unmask violations of federal law that put lives at risk.” An electronic logging device, or ELD, automatically records driving time. It monitors engine hours, vehicle movement, miles driven, and location information. Although many fleets already are using some version of electronic logbooks, the agency estimates making them mandatory will save 26 lives and prevent 562 injuries each year. Truck and bus drivers who currently use paper log books must adopt ELDs within two years. The agency estimates about 3 million drivers will be affected. However, drivers of vehicles manufactured before model year 2000 will not have to use ELDs. Motor carriers that are already using electronic log systems compliant with current federal rules (defined as Automatic On-Board Recording Devices, or AOBRDs) have an extra two years to switch over to the new ELD requirements. The rule includes technology specifications detailing performance and design requirements for ELDs so manufacturers are able to produce compliant devices and systems. It also establishes new hours-of-service supporting document (shipping documents, fuel purchase receipts, etc.) requirements that the agency said will result in additional paperwork reductions. In most cases, a motor carrier would not be required to retain supporting documents verifying on-duty driving time. The rule strictly prohibits using ELDs to harass drivers. (A separate FMCSA rulemaking further safeguards commercial drivers from being coerced to violate federal safety regulations and provides the agency with the authority to take enforcement actions not only against motor carriers, but also against shippers, receivers, and transportation intermediaries.) The rule permits the use of smartphones and other wireless devices as ELDs, so long as they satisfy technical specifications, are certified, and are listed on an FMCSA website. Canadian- and Mexican-domiciled drivers will also be required to use ELDs when operating on U.S. roadways. In developing the ELD Final Rule, FMCSA said it relied on input from its Motor Carrier Safety Advisory Committee, feedback from two public listening sessions, comments filed during an extended comment period following the 2011 proposed rule, and comments to the 2014 supplementary proposed rule. The final rule also incorporates mandates included in the Moving Ahead for Progress in the 21st Century Act and other statutes. The rule is scheduled for official publication Friday, Dec. 11. A copy of the ELD Final Rule is available at: https://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/hours-service/elds/electronic-logging-devices-and-hours-service-supporting-documents Further information, including a searchable list of frequently asked questions and a calendar of free training webinars, is available at www.fmcsa.dot.gov/elds. Source: http://www.truckinginfo.com/news/story/2015/12/fmcsa-announces-electronic-logs-mandate.aspx

Dec 10, 2015 at 04:41 PM CST

+ 3 - 7

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC

Wendell, MN

108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN

Added expense to an already taxed independent driver - this sucks!

By early December 2017, an estimated 3 million commercial drivers will have thrown out their paper logbooks. A long-anticipated rule requiring electronic logging devices for truck and bus driver hours of service was announced Thursday morning.

“Since 1938, complex, on-duty/off-duty logs for truck and bus drivers were made with pencil and paper, virtually impossible to verify,” said U.S. Transportation Secretary Anthony Foxx. “This automated technology not only brings logging records into the modern age, it also allows roadside safety inspectors to unmask violations of federal law that put lives at risk.”

An electronic logging device, or ELD, automatically records driving time. It monitors engine hours, vehicle movement, miles driven, and location information. Although many fleets already are using some version of electronic logbooks, the agency estimates making them mandatory will save 26 lives and prevent 562 injuries each year.

Truck and bus drivers who currently use paper log books must adopt ELDs within two years. The agency estimates about 3 million drivers will be affected. However, drivers of vehicles manufactured before model year 2000 will not have to use ELDs.

Motor carriers that are already using electronic log systems compliant with current federal rules (defined as Automatic On-Board Recording Devices, or AOBRDs) have an extra two years to switch over to the new ELD requirements.

The rule includes technology specifications detailing performance and design requirements for ELDs so manufacturers are able to produce compliant devices and systems.

It also establishes new hours-of-service supporting document (shipping documents, fuel purchase receipts, etc.) requirements that the agency said will result in additional paperwork reductions. In most cases, a motor carrier would not be required to retain supporting documents verifying on-duty driving time.

The rule strictly prohibits using ELDs to harass drivers. (A separate FMCSA rulemaking further safeguards commercial drivers from being coerced to violate federal safety regulations and provides the agency with the authority to take enforcement actions not only against motor carriers, but also against shippers, receivers, and transportation intermediaries.)

The rule permits the use of smartphones and other wireless devices as ELDs, so long as they satisfy technical specifications, are certified, and are listed on an FMCSA website.
Canadian- and Mexican-domiciled drivers will also be required to use ELDs when operating on U.S. roadways.

In developing the ELD Final Rule, FMCSA said it relied on input from its Motor Carrier Safety Advisory Committee, feedback from two public listening sessions, comments filed during an extended comment period following the 2011 proposed rule, and comments to the 2014 supplementary proposed rule. The final rule also incorporates mandates included in the Moving Ahead for Progress in the 21st Century Act and other statutes.

The rule is scheduled for official publication Friday, Dec. 11. A copy of the ELD Final Rule is available at: https://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/hours-service/elds/electronic-logging-devices-and-hours-service-supporting-documents

Further information, including a searchable list of frequently asked questions and a calendar of free training webinars, is available at www.fmcsa.dot.gov/elds.

Source:

http://www.truckinginfo.com/news/story/2015/12/fmcsa-announces-electronic-logs-mandate.aspx

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 04:52 PM CST + 6
JEFF PEARSON C & R TRUCKING INC PAYSON, UT 928 Posts, 225 +, 94 -	JEFF PEARSON C & R TRUCKING INC - PAYSON, UT So now the government will tell you when you can work and when you can sleep.. So you will be forced to work tired and lay in your bunk wide awake.. Next they will be telling you when to ****. No other industry that has hours recorded.. As in pilots, ship captains etc.. Have a recorder making sure they wont maybe possibly fudge their hours of work.. There is already a lack of parking areas for trucks.. So now that 11 hours will work out to 9or 10..just because you dont want to be recorded over hours and need a SAFE place to park.. I bet a hundred bucks that because of this that accidents and fatalities will go up.. Not down as this pencil pusher thinks..

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 04:52 PM CST

+ 6

JEFF PEARSON

C & R TRUCKING INC

PAYSON, UT

928 Posts, 225 +, 94 -

JEFF PEARSON

C & R TRUCKING INC - PAYSON, UT

So now the government will tell you when you can work and when you can sleep.. So you will be forced to work tired and lay in your bunk wide awake.. Next they will be telling you when to ****. No other industry that has hours recorded.. As in pilots, ship captains etc.. Have a recorder making sure they wont maybe possibly fudge their hours of work.. There is already a lack of parking areas for trucks.. So now that 11 hours will work out to 9or 10..just because you dont want to be recorded over hours and need a SAFE place to park.. I bet a hundred bucks that because of this that accidents and fatalities will go up.. Not down as this pencil pusher thinks..

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 04:52 PM CST + 2 - 1
DANIEL CORBIN LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC COLUMBIA, NC 210 Posts, 181 +, 22 -	DANIEL CORBIN LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC - COLUMBIA, NC Like I said earlier to day. The value of my "fleet" just doubled! Well until the insurance companies decide they can charge more for pre 2000 trucks.

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 05:12 PM CST - 1
JERRY BECK BECK BULK HANKAMER, TX 513 Posts, 47 +, 5 -	JERRY BECK BECK BULK - HANKAMER, TX Originally Posted by: DANIEL CORBIN Quote: "Like I said earlier to day. The value of my "fleet" just doubled! Well until the insurance companies decide they can charge more for pre 2000 trucks." I don't think age of truck is gonna help us Daniel. Here's what AAAcompliance has on their web site. Im old enough so I think this is where I exit trucking and do a little loafing. Older trucks don’t escape this mandate for integration. If the truck is equipped with a mechanical engine, you would need to make expensive upgrades to enable any of the approved ELD’s to work properly.

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 05:12 PM CST

- 1

JERRY BECK

BECK BULK

HANKAMER, TX

513 Posts, 47 +, 5 -

JERRY BECK

BECK BULK - HANKAMER, TX

Originally Posted by: DANIEL CORBIN
Quote: "Like I said earlier to day. The value of my "fleet" just doubled! Well until the insurance companies decide they can charge more for pre 2000 trucks."

I don't think age of truck is gonna help us Daniel. Here's what AAAcompliance has on their web site. Im old enough so I think this is where I exit trucking and do a little loafing.

Older trucks don’t escape this mandate for integration. If the truck is equipped with a mechanical engine, you would need to make expensive upgrades to enable any of the approved ELD’s to work properly.

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 05:32 PM CST
DANIEL CORBIN LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC COLUMBIA, NC 210 Posts, 181 +, 22 -	DANIEL CORBIN LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC - COLUMBIA, NC Click on link above. #3 ELD exemption for drive away and pre 2000 trucks

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 05:44 PM CST + 1
HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC Wendell, MN 108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -	HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN Originally Posted by: JEFF PEARSON Quote: "So now the government will tell you when you can work and when you can sleep.. So you will be forced to work tired and lay in your bunk wide awake.. Next they will be telling you when to ****. No other industry that has hours recorded.. As in pilots, ship captains etc.. Have a recorder making sure they wont maybe possibly fudge their hours of work.. There is already a lack of parking areas for trucks.. So now that 11 hours will work out to 9or 10..just because you dont want to be recorded over hours and need a SAFE place to park.. I bet a hundred bucks that because of this that accidents and fatalities will go up.. Not down as this pencil pusher thinks.." I am just happy that there is two of us on one truck. Otherwise, we would go broke with these new requirements.

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 05:44 PM CST

+ 1

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC

Wendell, MN

108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN

Originally Posted by: JEFF PEARSON
Quote: "So now the government will tell you when you can work and when you can sleep.. So you will be forced to work tired and lay in your bunk wide awake.. Next they will be telling you when to ****. No other industry that has hours recorded.. As in pilots, ship captains etc.. Have a recorder making sure they wont maybe possibly fudge their hours of work.. There is already a lack of parking areas for trucks.. So now that 11 hours will work out to 9or 10..just because you dont want to be recorded over hours and need a SAFE place to park.. I bet a hundred bucks that because of this that accidents and fatalities will go up.. Not down as this pencil pusher thinks.."

I am just happy that there is two of us on one truck. Otherwise, we would go broke with these new requirements.

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 05:45 PM CST
HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC Wendell, MN 108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -	HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN Originally Posted by: JERRY BECK Quote: "I don't think age of truck is gonna help us Daniel. Here's what AAAcompliance has on their web site. Im old enough so I think this is where I exit trucking and do a little loafing. Older trucks don’t escape this mandate for integration. If the truck is equipped with a mechanical engine, you would need to make expensive upgrades to enable any of the approved ELD’s to work properly." According to the ruling trucks manufactured before model year 2000 will not have to use ELDs.

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 05:45 PM CST

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC

Wendell, MN

108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN

Originally Posted by: JERRY BECK
Quote: "I don't think age of truck is gonna help us Daniel. Here's what AAAcompliance has on their web site. Im old enough so I think this is where I exit trucking and do a little loafing. Older trucks don’t escape this mandate for integration. If the truck is equipped with a mechanical engine, you would need to make expensive upgrades to enable any of the approved ELD’s to work properly."

According to the ruling trucks manufactured before model year 2000 will not have to use ELDs.

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 05:55 PM CST
DANIEL CORBIN LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC COLUMBIA, NC 210 Posts, 181 +, 22 -	DANIEL CORBIN LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC - COLUMBIA, NC Originally Posted by: HOWARD RASMUSSEN Quote: "I am just happy that there is two of us on one truck. Otherwise, we would go broke with these new requirements." Not trying to be a smart ass. But how's that work? Wouldn't you split the miles/pay?

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 06:06 PM CST + 2
KEVIN TURNER A&R BULKTRANSPORT Manito, IL 28 Posts, 0 +, 0 -	KEVIN TURNER A&R BULKTRANSPORT - Manito, IL We all need to call are reps and senators and tell them this is just can not happen!!

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 07:06 PM CST
JEFF PEARSON C & R TRUCKING INC PAYSON, UT 928 Posts, 225 +, 94 -	JEFF PEARSON C & R TRUCKING INC - PAYSON, UT I bet the EPA will for some reason require all trucks to have an electronic engine...

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 07:47 PM CST
DANIEL CORBIN LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC COLUMBIA, NC 210 Posts, 181 +, 22 -	DANIEL CORBIN LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC - COLUMBIA, NC Originally Posted by: JEFF PEARSON Quote: "I bet the EPA will for some reason require all trucks to have an electronic engine..." All my trucks 1992-1999 all have electronic engines. The EPA will try to screw us over some how. The big companies will want O/O and lease trucks to be newer.

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 09:20 PM CST + 1 - 1
ALFRED JORDAN POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC PECULIAR, MO 1189 Posts, 207 +, 6 -	ALFRED JORDAN POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC - PECULIAR, MO Originally Posted by: DANIEL CORBIN Quote: "Like I said earlier to day. The value of my "fleet" just doubled! Well until the insurance companies decide they can charge more for pre 2000 trucks." Dan should I tell my dad to double the price on that 92 Pete? LOL I just want it out of my yard, I figure if you end up with it then in about two years it will double in value. For those of you that want old school electronic logs here is where you get them. It is free: www.keeptruckin.com My guys all love them, my dad is playing with it and has agreed that it is far better than paper logs Since we went to electronic logs now brokers, shippers, and receivers can no longer argue about the times we arrived and left. They have actually increased our profit margin on detention, beings the rates are so cheap right now, we just pray and hope the shipper and receiver continue in their lazy ways, makes us more money. LOL HA HA - HA HA. What you going to do now brokers? HA-HA What about those craphole shippers and receivers that believe you work for free? HA-HA You guys just start thinking like that and guess what the government just did us a favor, the only thing they could do to make it better is reinstate a real sleeper birth split. If we had that back then electronic logs would indeed be the best thing to happen to our industry in a very long time. If you can read this forum and post on this forum then you will have no probems with electronic logs.

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 09:20 PM CST

+ 1 - 1

ALFRED JORDAN

POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC

PECULIAR, MO

1189 Posts, 207 +, 6 -

ALFRED JORDAN

POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC - PECULIAR, MO

Originally Posted by: DANIEL CORBIN
Quote: "Like I said earlier to day. The value of my "fleet" just doubled! Well until the insurance companies decide they can charge more for pre 2000 trucks."

Dan should I tell my dad to double the price on that 92 Pete? LOL

I just want it out of my yard, I figure if you end up with it then in about two years it will double in value.

For those of you that want old school electronic logs here is where you get them. It is free: www.keeptruckin.com

My guys all love them, my dad is playing with it and has agreed that it is far better than paper logs

Since we went to electronic logs now brokers, shippers, and receivers can no longer argue about the times we arrived and left. They have actually increased our profit margin on detention, beings the rates are so cheap right now, we just pray and hope the shipper and receiver continue in their lazy ways, makes us more money. LOL HA HA - HA HA. What you going to do now brokers? HA-HA What about those craphole shippers and receivers that believe you work for free? HA-HA

You guys just start thinking like that and guess what the government just did us a favor, the only thing they could do to make it better is reinstate a real sleeper birth split. If we had that back then electronic logs would indeed be the best thing to happen to our industry in a very long time. If you can read this forum and post on this forum then you will have no probems with electronic logs.

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 09:39 PM CST + 2
DANIEL CORBIN LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC COLUMBIA, NC 210 Posts, 181 +, 22 -	DANIEL CORBIN LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC - COLUMBIA, NC I agree with you, they can't argue how long my truck has been there. It's right here on the e-log. Ha-ha. If a guy is running by the book now it should be no big deal. I'm just going to play it out. we'll keep on doing what we do. Change what we have to and hopefully still be here in two years.

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 11:25 PM CST + 6
DAVE WINTERS DWT TRUCKING CLEARWATER, MN 794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -	DAVE WINTERS DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN Originally Posted by: JEFF PEARSON Quote: "So now the government will tell you when you can work and when you can sleep.. So you will be forced to work tired and lay in your bunk wide awake.. Next they will be telling you when to ****. No other industry that has hours recorded.. As in pilots, ship captains etc.. Have a recorder making sure they wont maybe possibly fudge their hours of work.. There is already a lack of parking areas for trucks.. So now that 11 hours will work out to 9or 10..just because you dont want to be recorded over hours and need a SAFE place to park.. I bet a hundred bucks that because of this that accidents and fatalities will go up.. Not down as this pencil pusher thinks.." Well let's see if we can connect the dot's here. The Mega fleets with their electronic logs, and sky high accident records, (That require them to be self insured, because no insurance company on the open market would ever write them a policy, based on their crash history) , Are now considered to be the poster child of safety? And those same folk's are now being put in charge of policy making? So we are now going to punish the carriers with good crash score's, and reward the carriers with the worst crash score's? And the public is not expected to think that the industry is out of control? Or full of corruption?

Replied on Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 11:25 PM CST

+ 6

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING

CLEARWATER, MN

794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN

Well let's see if we can connect the dot's here. The Mega fleets with their electronic logs, and sky high accident records, (That require them to be self insured, because no insurance company on the open market would ever write them a policy, based on their crash history) , Are now considered to be the poster child of safety? And those same folk's are now being put in charge of policy making? So we are now going to punish the carriers with good crash score's, and reward the carriers with the worst crash score's? And the public is not expected to think that the industry is out of control? Or full of corruption?

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 06:49 AM CST + 1
JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING Fair Grove, MO 610 Posts, 0 +, 1 -	JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING - Fair Grove, MO Originally Posted by: DAVE WINTERS Quote: " Well let's see if we can connect the dot's here. The Mega fleets with their electronic logs, and sky high accident records, (That require them to be self insured, because no insurance company on the open market would ever write them a policy, based on their crash history) , Are now considered to be the poster child of safety? And those same folk's are now being put in charge of policy making? So we are now going to punish the carriers with good crash score's, and reward the carriers with the worst crash score's? And the public is not expected to think that the industry is out of control? Or full of corruption?" Your awesome Dave

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 06:49 AM CST

+ 1

JASON WEAST

FAIR GROVE TRUCKING

Fair Grove, MO

610 Posts, 0 +, 1 -

JASON WEAST

FAIR GROVE TRUCKING - Fair Grove, MO

Originally Posted by: DAVE WINTERS
Quote: " Well let's see if we can connect the dot's here. The Mega fleets with their electronic logs, and sky high accident records, (That require them to be self insured, because no insurance company on the open market would ever write them a policy, based on their crash history) , Are now considered to be the poster child of safety? And those same folk's are now being put in charge of policy making? So we are now going to punish the carriers with good crash score's, and reward the carriers with the worst crash score's? And the public is not expected to think that the industry is out of control? Or full of corruption?"

Your awesome Dave

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 08:47 AM CST + 2
DAVE WINTERS DWT TRUCKING CLEARWATER, MN 794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -	DAVE WINTERS DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN Originally Posted by: DAVE WINTERS Quote: " Well let's see if we can connect the dot's here. The Mega fleets with their electronic logs, and sky high accident records, (That require them to be self insured, because no insurance company on the open market would ever write them a policy, based on their crash history) , Are now considered to be the poster child of safety? And those same folk's are now being put in charge of policy making? So we are now going to punish the carriers with good crash score's, and reward the carriers with the worst crash score's? And the public is not expected to think that the industry is out of control? Or full of corruption?" If the rest of the government were to use the same logic that's being applied here, then the mafia would be incharge of the FBI, the cartel would be incharge of the DEA, the commies would be incharge of our military, and ISIS would be incharge of homeland security.

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 08:47 AM CST

+ 2

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING

CLEARWATER, MN

794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN

If the rest of the government were to use the same logic that's being applied here, then the mafia would be incharge of the FBI, the cartel would be incharge of the DEA, the commies would be incharge of our military, and ISIS would be incharge of homeland security.

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 08:55 AM CST + 2
ALFRED JORDAN POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC PECULIAR, MO 1189 Posts, 207 +, 6 -	ALFRED JORDAN POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC - PECULIAR, MO Originally Posted by: DAVE WINTERS Quote: "If the rest of the government were to use the same logic that's being applied here, then the mafia would be incharge of the FBI, the cartel would be incharge of the DEA, the commies would be incharge of our military, and ISIS would be incharge of homeland security." I thought that was how it was. LOL

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 08:55 AM CST

+ 2

ALFRED JORDAN

POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC

PECULIAR, MO

1189 Posts, 207 +, 6 -

ALFRED JORDAN

POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC - PECULIAR, MO

Originally Posted by: DAVE WINTERS
Quote: "If the rest of the government were to use the same logic that's being applied here, then the mafia would be incharge of the FBI, the cartel would be incharge of the DEA, the commies would be incharge of our military, and ISIS would be incharge of homeland security."

I thought that was how it was. LOL

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 10:20 AM CST
DAVE WINTERS DWT TRUCKING CLEARWATER, MN 794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -	DAVE WINTERS DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN Originally Posted by: ALFRED JORDAN Quote: "I thought that was how it was. LOL" In the old days, jay edgar hoover would be going after the folks involved in this corruption scandel, and exposing the pay offs, going on under the table. A very dangerous precident is being set here, if this is allowed to stand. Proving a RICO case here should be pretty easy.

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 10:20 AM CST

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING

CLEARWATER, MN

794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN

Originally Posted by: ALFRED JORDAN
Quote: "I thought that was how it was. LOL"

In the old days, jay edgar hoover would be going after the folks involved in this corruption scandel, and exposing the pay offs, going on under the table. A very dangerous precident is being set here, if this is allowed to stand. Proving a RICO case here should be pretty easy.

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 10:25 AM CST
MIKE CUMMINGS LIQUID TANK OWNER OPERATORS LLC EDINBORO, PA 38 Posts, 0 +, 0 -	MIKE CUMMINGS LIQUID TANK OWNER OPERATORS LLC - EDINBORO, PA has anyone found a loop hole for glider kits. if i dont find one my 2012 coronado is for sale. 265000 miles

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 10:43 AM CST
MIKE CUMMINGS LIQUID TANK OWNER OPERATORS LLC EDINBORO, PA 38 Posts, 0 +, 0 -	MIKE CUMMINGS LIQUID TANK OWNER OPERATORS LLC - EDINBORO, PA Here are 500 pages to go through. Enjoy the free E-book from fmcsa! https://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/sites/fmcsa.dot.gov/files/docs/FMCSA-ELD-Final-Rule_12-10-2015.pdf

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 10:43 AM CST
DANIEL CORBIN LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC COLUMBIA, NC 210 Posts, 181 +, 22 -	DANIEL CORBIN LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC - COLUMBIA, NC Originally Posted by: MIKE CUMMINGS Quote: "has anyone found a loop hole for glider kits. if i dont find one my 2012 coronado is for sale. 265000 miles " There is an article from overdrive about this. There is plenty of gray area. Looks like if you have a glider with a mechanical engine you would be exempted. They exempted 2000 and older trucks because some of the operating systems may not be able to do what they want. So if you have a 2000 or older engine maybe. I would expect some kind of revision/clarification in the future. This may be a blessing or a curse to the glider builders. And with new EPA regs. Ect. They may find a way to put us out of business yet! I have all pre 2000 trucks I'm not jumping for joy just yet. I've seen what they've done to loggers in California.

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 10:43 AM CST

DANIEL CORBIN

LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC

COLUMBIA, NC

210 Posts, 181 +, 22 -

DANIEL CORBIN

LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC - COLUMBIA, NC

Originally Posted by: MIKE CUMMINGS
Quote: "has anyone found a loop hole for glider kits. if i dont find one my 2012 coronado is for sale. 265000 miles "

There is an article from overdrive about this. There is plenty of gray area. Looks like if you have a glider with a mechanical engine you would be exempted. They exempted 2000 and older trucks because some of the operating systems may not be able to do what they want. So if you have a 2000 or older engine maybe. I would expect some kind of revision/clarification in the future. This may be a blessing or a curse to the glider builders. And with new EPA regs. Ect. They may find a way to put us out of business yet! I have all pre 2000 trucks I'm not jumping for joy just yet. I've seen what they've done to loggers in California.

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 10:45 AM CST + 2
JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING Fair Grove, MO 610 Posts, 0 +, 1 -	JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING - Fair Grove, MO I wonder how many lawsuits are going to fire up because now we can prove that we've been sitting at shippers. I can't wait until the attorneys start advertising for truckers to sue shippers and receivers because we are not allowed to drive down the road because we are out of time because we were sitting at shippers and receivers and we're not making enough money to make ends meet because we're getting screwed out of our time this is going to get really interesting really fast

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 10:45 AM CST

+ 2

JASON WEAST

FAIR GROVE TRUCKING

Fair Grove, MO

610 Posts, 0 +, 1 -

JASON WEAST

FAIR GROVE TRUCKING - Fair Grove, MO

I wonder how many lawsuits are going to fire up because now we can prove that we've been sitting at shippers. I can't wait until the attorneys start advertising for truckers to sue shippers and receivers because we are not allowed to drive down the road because we are out of time because we were sitting at shippers and receivers and we're not making enough money to make ends meet because we're getting screwed out of our time this is going to get really interesting really fast

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 12:00 PM CST
MIKE CUMMINGS LIQUID TANK OWNER OPERATORS LLC EDINBORO, PA 38 Posts, 0 +, 0 -	MIKE CUMMINGS LIQUID TANK OWNER OPERATORS LLC - EDINBORO, PA I did not see any loopholes for glider kits in section VII of that. If anyone else finds something let us know. Looks like the model year of the truck is all that matters. I did not see anything regarding the year of the engine.

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 12:18 PM CST + 1
GLENN SELLHORST MCWIESER TRUCKING Fremont, NE 108 Posts, 3 +, 7 -	GLENN SELLHORST MCWIESER TRUCKING - Fremont, NE I feel that the electronic logs could be good for our industry only if EVERY truck in the industry has to have them no matter how big or how small you are, apportioned or county commercial you have to have them then everyone is on the same playing field!

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 12:39 PM CST
JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING Fair Grove, MO 610 Posts, 0 +, 1 -	JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING - Fair Grove, MO Originally Posted by: MIKE CUMMINGS Quote: "I did not see any loopholes for glider kits in section VII of that. If anyone else finds something let us know. Looks like the model year of the truck is all that matters. I did not see anything regarding the year of the engine. " I also just read it I also see that it plainly states the year of the truck only does not specify whether you have an electronic motor a glider kit or anything of that sort

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 12:39 PM CST

JASON WEAST

FAIR GROVE TRUCKING

Fair Grove, MO

610 Posts, 0 +, 1 -

JASON WEAST

FAIR GROVE TRUCKING - Fair Grove, MO

Originally Posted by: MIKE CUMMINGS
Quote: "I did not see any loopholes for glider kits in section VII of that. If anyone else finds something let us know. Looks like the model year of the truck is all that matters. I did not see anything regarding the year of the engine. "

I also just read it I also see that it plainly states the year of the truck only does not specify whether you have an electronic motor a glider kit or anything of that sort

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 12:41 PM CST + 2
DAVE WINTERS DWT TRUCKING CLEARWATER, MN 794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -	DAVE WINTERS DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN Originally Posted by: GLENN SELLHORST Quote: "I feel that the electronic logs could be good for our industry only if EVERY truck in the industry has to have them no matter how big or how small you are, apportioned or county commercial you have to have them then everyone is on the same playing field! " IF your so worried about a level playing field, then the first thing that needs to go is the law that allows the mega carriers to self insure. If they had to buy insurance on the open market like the rest of us, that would be a level playing field.

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 12:41 PM CST

+ 2

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING

CLEARWATER, MN

794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN

Originally Posted by: GLENN SELLHORST
Quote: "I feel that the electronic logs could be good for our industry only if EVERY truck in the industry has to have them no matter how big or how small you are, apportioned or county commercial you have to have them then everyone is on the same playing field! "

IF your so worried about a level playing field, then the first thing that needs to go is the law that allows the mega carriers to self insure. If they had to buy insurance on the open market like the rest of us, that would be a level playing field.

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 12:48 PM CST
GLENN SELLHORST MCWIESER TRUCKING Fremont, NE 108 Posts, 3 +, 7 -	GLENN SELLHORST MCWIESER TRUCKING - Fremont, NE Originally Posted by: DAVE WINTERS Quote: "IF your so worried about a level playing field, then the first thing that needs to go is the law that allows the mega carriers to self insure. If they had to buy insurance on the open market like the rest of us, that would be a level playing field." Het Dave i am not trying to start a pissing match, I am small time owner operator just saying lets make everything fair

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 12:48 PM CST

GLENN SELLHORST

MCWIESER TRUCKING

Fremont, NE

108 Posts, 3 +, 7 -

GLENN SELLHORST

MCWIESER TRUCKING - Fremont, NE

Originally Posted by: DAVE WINTERS
Quote: "IF your so worried about a level playing field, then the first thing that needs to go is the law that allows the mega carriers to self insure. If they had to buy insurance on the open market like the rest of us, that would be a level playing field."

Het Dave i am not trying to start a pissing match, I am small time owner operator just saying lets make everything fair

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 12:55 PM CST
JOHN TENNENT CRUNCHTIME EXPRESS LLC. Tallahassee, FL 10 Posts, 0 +, 2 -	JOHN TENNENT CRUNCHTIME EXPRESS LLC. - Tallahassee, FL Hey Jeff ,enjoy your comments. This not directed at you at all. All the truck websites say we when from 5th deadliest to 1st job back in 2013,2014 was worst. I think Elogs, 70hs recap makes this insane as far as anything to do with safety.

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 01:02 PM CST
DAVE WINTERS DWT TRUCKING CLEARWATER, MN 794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -	DAVE WINTERS DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN Originally Posted by: GLENN SELLHORST Quote: "Het Dave i am not trying to start a pissing match, I am small time owner operator just saying lets make everything fair" Glenn don't worry, I realize that wasn't your intention.

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 11:19 PM CST + 2
JOE BLOW JOE BLOW Saint Joseph, MO 54 Posts, 5 +, 0 -	JOE BLOW JOE BLOW - Saint Joseph, MO Originally Posted by: DAVE WINTERS Quote: "IF your so worried about a level playing field, then the first thing that needs to go is the law that allows the mega carriers to self insure. If they had to buy insurance on the open market like the rest of us, that would be a level playing field." I guess that the level playing field would be all of us getting kickbacks from Pilot, Loves etc for fuel like the Mega carriers, Kenworth, Peterbilt, Volvo etc would sell us new trucks priced like the mega carriers, etc There are so many things that are not level why on earth would I want that manditory elog in my truck, I typically dont wait more than 2 hours to load or unload, I pull a step deck so no docks wearhouses etc and I deffinatly dont want some speed limiter device so I can be as unsafe as the mega carriers. I run pretty close to legal right now because I choose to. The loads have too much time built into them between loading and delivery. I beleive this is a result of elogs. There is no way it takes 6 days to run 1800 miles and when I showed up 3 days early they made arrangements to unload at a different location, rather than pay me to sit there 3 days. The problem I have is with the rates So I guess we all need to be paid the same rate like the Mega carriers. California with there rediculus laws should have a $1,000 surcharge on each load going in with a min rate of $4.00 per mile coming out to cover all there Environmental issues they force on all of us. By the way I have a 2000 Kenworth that gets a whopping 7.2 mpg because I choose to drive 68mph instead of 80 but its by choice and I can stand on the fuel oedal to get around the mega fleet trucks at 65. Rant over and I'm out

Replied on Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 11:19 PM CST

+ 2

JOE BLOW

JOE BLOW

Saint Joseph, MO

54 Posts, 5 +, 0 -

JOE BLOW

JOE BLOW - Saint Joseph, MO

I guess that the level playing field would be all of us getting kickbacks from Pilot, Loves etc for fuel like the Mega carriers,
Kenworth, Peterbilt, Volvo etc would sell us new trucks priced like the mega carriers, etc
There are so many things that are not level why on earth would I want that manditory elog in my truck, I typically dont wait more than 2 hours to load or unload, I pull a step deck so no docks wearhouses etc and I deffinatly dont want some speed limiter device so I can be as unsafe as the mega carriers.
I run pretty close to legal right now because I choose to.
The loads have too much time built into them between loading and delivery. I beleive this is a result of elogs.
There is no way it takes 6 days to run 1800 miles and when I showed up 3 days early they made arrangements to unload at a different location, rather than pay me to sit there 3 days.
The problem I have is with the rates So I guess we all need to be paid the same rate like the Mega carriers.
California with there rediculus laws should have a $1,000 surcharge on each load going in with a min rate of $4.00 per mile coming out to cover all there Environmental issues they force on all of us.
By the way I have a 2000 Kenworth that gets a whopping 7.2 mpg because I choose to drive 68mph instead of 80 but its by choice and I can stand on the fuel oedal to get around the mega fleet trucks at 65.
Rant over and I'm out

Replied on Sat, Dec 12, 2015 at 07:10 AM CST
MIKE MAGNESS MJ MAGNESS NEW BETHLEHEM, PA 22 Posts, 0 +, 0 -	MIKE MAGNESS MJ MAGNESS - NEW BETHLEHEM, PA Originally Posted by: JOE BLOW Quote: "I guess that the level playing field would be all of us getting kickbacks from Pilot, Loves etc for fuel like the Mega carriers, Kenworth, Peterbilt, Volvo etc would sell us new trucks priced like the mega carriers, etc There are so many things that are not level why on earth would I want that manditory elog in my truck, I typically dont wait more than 2 hours to load or unload, I pull a step deck so no docks wearhouses etc and I deffinatly dont want some speed limiter device so I can be as unsafe as the mega carriers. I run pretty close to legal right now because I choose to. The loads have too much time built into them between loading and delivery. I beleive this is a result of elogs. There is no way it takes 6 days to run 1800 miles and when I showed up 3 days early they made arrangements to unload at a different location, rather than pay me to sit there 3 days. The problem I have is with the rates So I guess we all need to be paid the same rate like the Mega carriers. California with there rediculus laws should have a $1,000 surcharge on each load going in with a min rate of $4.00 per mile coming out to cover all there Environmental issues they force on all of us. By the way I have a 2000 Kenworth that gets a whopping 7.2 mpg because I choose to drive 68mph instead of 80 but its by choice and I can stand on the fuel oedal to get around the mega fleet trucks at 65. Rant over and I'm out" Amen! The advantage we little guys have over the mega carriers is efficiency and customer service,they will never be able to compete in that arena and the small shippers will pay for that. Let the big boys take care of each other.

Replied on Sat, Dec 12, 2015 at 07:10 AM CST

MIKE MAGNESS

MJ MAGNESS

NEW BETHLEHEM, PA

22 Posts, 0 +, 0 -

MIKE MAGNESS

MJ MAGNESS - NEW BETHLEHEM, PA

Originally Posted by: JOE BLOW
Quote: "I guess that the level playing field would be all of us getting kickbacks from Pilot, Loves etc for fuel like the Mega carriers, Kenworth, Peterbilt, Volvo etc would sell us new trucks priced like the mega carriers, etc There are so many things that are not level why on earth would I want that manditory elog in my truck, I typically dont wait more than 2 hours to load or unload, I pull a step deck so no docks wearhouses etc and I deffinatly dont want some speed limiter device so I can be as unsafe as the mega carriers. I run pretty close to legal right now because I choose to. The loads have too much time built into them between loading and delivery. I beleive this is a result of elogs. There is no way it takes 6 days to run 1800 miles and when I showed up 3 days early they made arrangements to unload at a different location, rather than pay me to sit there 3 days. The problem I have is with the rates So I guess we all need to be paid the same rate like the Mega carriers. California with there rediculus laws should have a $1,000 surcharge on each load going in with a min rate of $4.00 per mile coming out to cover all there Environmental issues they force on all of us. By the way I have a 2000 Kenworth that gets a whopping 7.2 mpg because I choose to drive 68mph instead of 80 but its by choice and I can stand on the fuel oedal to get around the mega fleet trucks at 65. Rant over and I'm out"

Amen! The advantage we little guys have over the mega carriers is efficiency and customer service,they will never be able to compete in that arena and the small shippers will pay for that. Let the big boys take care of each other.

Replied on Sat, Dec 12, 2015 at 07:27 AM CST
JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING Fair Grove, MO 610 Posts, 0 +, 1 -	JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING - Fair Grove, MO Good example of what he is saying , my neighbor is a independent that has a power only account with Prime, with his fuel discount across the board for last week was $1.52. So how can that be a level field ?

Replied on Sat, Dec 12, 2015 at 08:53 AM CST + 1
DEAN HUGHSON WALK-WAY TRANSPORT WINTHROP, IA 183 Posts, 53 +, 27 -	DEAN HUGHSON WALK-WAY TRANSPORT - WINTHROP, IA I agree. We have 2 years to adjust our rates to fit. A big task I think. Don't surrender. The thing I don't like is the 12-14 hour marathon followed by 10 hour screwing around in a travel plaza, formaly know as a truckstop. I hope to take as many of my breaks at the house so I can mow the lawn at get my 6-7 hours of sleep.

Replied on Sat, Dec 12, 2015 at 10:11 AM CST
ALFRED JORDAN POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC PECULIAR, MO 1189 Posts, 207 +, 6 -	ALFRED JORDAN POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC - PECULIAR, MO Originally Posted by: MIKE MAGNESS Quote: "Amen! The advantage we little guys have over the mega carriers is efficiency and customer service,they will never be able to compete in that arena and the small shippers will pay for that. Let the big boys take care of each other." Time for us little guys to hang together and start using leverage to our advantage. This is why we created the Independent Carrier Group, if you believe that we need to start working together and not against each other. If you run your business in an honorable fashion then you may want to join us. This is just for Independent Carriers we don't have an area exclusively for us, but now we do. http://www.independentcarriergroup.com

Replied on Sat, Dec 12, 2015 at 10:11 AM CST

ALFRED JORDAN

POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC

PECULIAR, MO

1189 Posts, 207 +, 6 -

ALFRED JORDAN

POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC - PECULIAR, MO

Originally Posted by: MIKE MAGNESS
Quote: "Amen! The advantage we little guys have over the mega carriers is efficiency and customer service,they will never be able to compete in that arena and the small shippers will pay for that. Let the big boys take care of each other."

Time for us little guys to hang together and start using leverage to our advantage.

This is why we created the Independent Carrier Group, if you believe that we need to start working together and not against each other. If you run your business in an honorable fashion then you may want to join us. This is just for Independent Carriers we don't have an area exclusively for us, but now we do.

http://www.independentcarriergroup.com

Replied on Mon, Dec 14, 2015 at 08:29 PM CST + 1
RICHARD SNIDER RDSLLC Calhoun, MO 12 Posts, 5 +, 0 -	RICHARD SNIDER RDSLLC - Calhoun, MO if it's for safety and the government wants to take the lead it should be put in all the dot vehicles snowplows state troopers etc

Replied on Tue, Dec 15, 2015 at 10:04 AM CST
GLENN SELLHORST MCWIESER TRUCKING Fremont, NE 108 Posts, 3 +, 7 -	GLENN SELLHORST MCWIESER TRUCKING - Fremont, NE Originally Posted by: RICHARD SNIDER Quote: "if it's for safety and the government wants to take the lead it should be put in all the dot vehicles snowplows state troopers etc" I agree with you Richard, but as long as they can keep ramming it up our backside they will not spend there money to do that, but they will keep spending our money

Replied on Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 04:58 PM CST
CARMEN PAPA CARMEN PAPA TRUCKING Hannibal, NY 4 Posts, 2 +, 0 -	CARMEN PAPA CARMEN PAPA TRUCKING - Hannibal, NY Problem is that app will not be qualified under the new rule. You will need to have it plugged into the ECM to record engine data.

Replied on Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 08:29 PM CST
JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING Fair Grove, MO 610 Posts, 0 +, 1 -	JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING - Fair Grove, MO Originally Posted by: CARMEN PAPA Quote: "Problem is that app will not be qualified under the new rule. You will need to have it plugged into the ECM to record engine data." Just curious but how are we supposed to use our smartphones then if it has to be linked to our truck computer

Replied on Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 12:51 PM CST
HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC Wendell, MN 108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -	HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN Originally Posted by: JASON WEAST Quote: "Just curious but how are we supposed to use our smartphones then if it has to be linked to our truck computer" Under the new law you won't be able to use your smartphone from my understanding. The cost of the new required monitoring system will cost around $1500. I may be incorrect on this but from my research is what I have found.

Replied on Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 12:51 PM CST

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC

Wendell, MN

108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN

Originally Posted by: JASON WEAST
Quote: "Just curious but how are we supposed to use our smartphones then if it has to be linked to our truck computer"

Under the new law you won't be able to use your smartphone from my understanding. The cost of the new required monitoring system will cost around $1500. I may be incorrect on this but from my research is what I have found.

Replied on Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 12:54 PM CST
HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC Wendell, MN 108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -	HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN Originally Posted by: JASON WEAST Quote: "Just curious but how are we supposed to use our smartphones then if it has to be linked to our truck computer" The new rule requires ELDs to be integrated with the truck’s engine and to use location information. They also must be tamper-resistant. The devices will track the truck’s movement but can allow for annotations by both drivers and carriers “to explain or correct records,” the rule says.

Replied on Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 12:54 PM CST

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC

Wendell, MN

108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN

Originally Posted by: JASON WEAST
Quote: "Just curious but how are we supposed to use our smartphones then if it has to be linked to our truck computer"

The new rule requires ELDs to be integrated with the truck’s engine and to use location information. They also must be tamper-resistant. The devices will track the truck’s movement but can allow for annotations by both drivers and carriers “to explain or correct records,” the rule says.

Replied on Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 12:55 PM CST
JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING Fair Grove, MO 610 Posts, 0 +, 1 -	JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING - Fair Grove, MO Originally Posted by: HOWARD RASMUSSEN Quote: "The new rule requires ELDs to be integrated with the truck’s engine and to use location information. They also must be tamper-resistant. The devices will track the truck’s movement but can allow for annotations by both drivers and carriers “to explain or correct records,” the rule says." So if I'm understanding you correctly Howard that means we can still manipulate the computer as long as we are single owner operator possibly.

Replied on Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 12:55 PM CST

JASON WEAST

FAIR GROVE TRUCKING

Fair Grove, MO

610 Posts, 0 +, 1 -

JASON WEAST

FAIR GROVE TRUCKING - Fair Grove, MO

Originally Posted by: HOWARD RASMUSSEN
Quote: "The new rule requires ELDs to be integrated with the truck’s engine and to use location information. They also must be tamper-resistant. The devices will track the truck’s movement but can allow for annotations by both drivers and carriers “to explain or correct records,” the rule says."

So if I'm understanding you correctly Howard that means we can still manipulate the computer as long as we are single owner operator possibly.

Replied on Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 12:59 PM CST
HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC Wendell, MN 108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -	HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN Originally Posted by: JASON WEAST Quote: "So if I'm understanding you correctly Howard that means we can still manipulate the computer as long as we are single owner operator possibly." First off, "tamper-resistant" means the driver and carrier cannot "change" the data the system is generating without a record of the change having taken place. To accomplish this, the original record must remain, and all changes to it and details of the changes (including any comments made) must be recorded and retained, as well. Also, the system must have a “malfunction” tracking system and a "diagnostic" system that tracks any problems (such as a driver unplugging it). Next, the rule specifically prohibits the driver deliberately doing anything that will reduce the effectiveness of the system, such as covering an antenna or disconnecting a component (both of which would be discovered in the malfunction/diagnostic systems and logs). Also, the robust data-capture requirements would make tampering difficult and easy to spot. Finally, carriers would have to have an "unassigned driver" account in the system, and all unassigned driving time must either be assigned out of the account to a specific driver or an explanation attached to it explaining why the unassigned driving took place if it cannot be assigned to a specific driver.

Replied on Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 12:59 PM CST

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC

Wendell, MN

108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN

Originally Posted by: JASON WEAST
Quote: "So if I'm understanding you correctly Howard that means we can still manipulate the computer as long as we are single owner operator possibly."

First off, "tamper-resistant" means the driver and carrier cannot "change" the data the system is generating without a record of the change having taken place. To accomplish this, the original record must remain, and all changes to it and details of the changes (including any comments made) must be recorded and retained, as well. Also, the system must have a “malfunction” tracking system and a "diagnostic" system that tracks any problems (such as a driver unplugging it).

Next, the rule specifically prohibits the driver deliberately doing anything that will reduce the effectiveness of the system, such as covering an antenna or disconnecting a component (both of which would be discovered in the malfunction/diagnostic systems and logs). Also, the robust data-capture requirements would make tampering difficult and easy to spot.

Finally, carriers would have to have an "unassigned driver" account in the system, and all unassigned driving time must either be assigned out of the account to a specific driver or an explanation attached to it explaining why the unassigned driving took place if it cannot be assigned to a specific driver.

Replied on Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 01:04 PM CST
JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING Fair Grove, MO 610 Posts, 0 +, 1 -	JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING - Fair Grove, MO A single non driver such as may be my wife or would it mean an outside firm that maybe i have to pay a fee to to call every time I need a change this is going to be a bummer

Replied on Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 01:08 PM CST
HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC Wendell, MN 108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -	HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN Originally Posted by: JASON WEAST Quote: "A single non driver such as may be my wife or would it mean an outside firm that maybe i have to pay a fee to to call every time I need a change this is going to be a bummer" Jason, these would be questions for FMCSA. I am far from an expert on this new law and it is a huge document to read. I agree that this is going to be a hassle for the most of us; however, it is something we are going to have to deal with.

Replied on Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 01:08 PM CST

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC

Wendell, MN

108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN

Originally Posted by: JASON WEAST
Quote: "A single non driver such as may be my wife or would it mean an outside firm that maybe i have to pay a fee to to call every time I need a change this is going to be a bummer"

Jason, these would be questions for FMCSA. I am far from an expert on this new law and it is a huge document to read. I agree that this is going to be a hassle for the most of us; however, it is something we are going to have to deal with.

Replied on Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 05:56 PM CST
MARK YORK ESPERANZA UNLIMITED LLC Altair, TX 4 Posts, 1 +, 0 -	MARK YORK ESPERANZA UNLIMITED LLC - Altair, TX Originally Posted by: ALFRED JORDAN Quote: " Time for us little guys to hang together and start using leverage to our advantage. This is why we created the Independent Carrier Group, if you believe that we need to start working together and not against each other. If you run your business in an honorable fashion then you may want to join us. This is just for Independent Carriers we don't have an area exclusively for us, but now we do. http://www.independentcarriergroup.com " I just started in this business. Like every other business, there's money to be made...otherwise, none of us would be here. The old adage is true, "You have to spend money to make money"...but I like to spend as little as absolutely necessary and make as much as possible. DUH! I joined NASTC National Association of Small Trucking Companies. I went to their NAST class a couple weeks before my truck hit the road...New Entrant Survival Training...GLAD I DID! I learned a lot. There was a guy in there with 40 years trucking experience. He said he wished he would have taken that class 40 years ago...gave me hope that my road will be a bit easier to start down. The statistics say...well, they say pretty much whatever the statusticians want them to say...BUT, the stats say 15% of new entrants survive past the first year. A whopping 85% of new entrants who take the NAST class survive past the first year! Dave, the founder, personally conducts the class. He spends a lot of his other time in Washington. He had a fairly big hand in getting the CSA Data removed from the public eye. That's been on his hit list for years and he and some others have hammered it hard enough Washington had to listen. Good for them. Anywho...If you want to be part of an organization that is all about helping the small trucking company, check them out www.nastc.com OH, don't forget the NASTC FleetOne fuel card. I've been saving between 50 and 70 cents per gallon at TA/Pilot! Pays for the $250 yearly membership in about 2 weeks. They have a bunch of other stuff like software to run your company, keep track of all your loads and drivers, payroll, lane estimates, quarterly filings, yearly filings, driver's expiration dates, all kinds of stuff. The fuel card is the bait to get you in, then the toy box is wide open...dig in! AND YOU NEVER GET AN ANSWERING MACHINE...EVER! CALL THEM AND A PERSON ANSWERS...YOU WANT TO TALK TO DAVE, JUST ASK, HE'S THE NEXT VOICE YOU HEAR!

Replied on Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 05:56 PM CST

MARK YORK

ESPERANZA UNLIMITED LLC

Altair, TX

4 Posts, 1 +, 0 -

MARK YORK

ESPERANZA UNLIMITED LLC - Altair, TX

Originally Posted by: ALFRED JORDAN
Quote: " Time for us little guys to hang together and start using leverage to our advantage. This is why we created the Independent Carrier Group, if you believe that we need to start working together and not against each other. If you run your business in an honorable fashion then you may want to join us. This is just for Independent Carriers we don't have an area exclusively for us, but now we do. http://www.independentcarriergroup.com "

I just started in this business. Like every other business, there's money to be made...otherwise, none of us would be here. The old adage is true, "You have to spend money to make money"...but I like to spend as little as absolutely necessary and make as much as possible. DUH!

I joined NASTC National Association of Small Trucking Companies. I went to their NAST class a couple weeks before my truck hit the road...New Entrant Survival Training...GLAD I DID! I learned a lot. There was a guy in there with 40 years trucking experience. He said he wished he would have taken that class 40 years ago...gave me hope that my road will be a bit easier to start down. The statistics say...well, they say pretty much whatever the statusticians want them to say...BUT, the stats say 15% of new entrants survive past the first year. A whopping 85% of new entrants who take the NAST class survive past the first year! Dave, the founder, personally conducts the class. He spends a lot of his other time in Washington. He had a fairly big hand in getting the CSA Data removed from the public eye. That's been on his hit list for years and he and some others have hammered it hard enough Washington had to listen. Good for them.

Anywho...If you want to be part of an organization that is all about helping the small trucking company, check them out www.nastc.com OH, don't forget the NASTC FleetOne fuel card. I've been saving between 50 and 70 cents per gallon at TA/Pilot! Pays for the $250 yearly membership in about 2 weeks. They have a bunch of other stuff like software to run your company, keep track of all your loads and drivers, payroll, lane estimates, quarterly filings, yearly filings, driver's expiration dates, all kinds of stuff. The fuel card is the bait to get you in, then the toy box is wide open...dig in!

AND YOU NEVER GET AN ANSWERING MACHINE...EVER! CALL THEM AND A PERSON ANSWERS...YOU WANT TO TALK TO DAVE, JUST ASK, HE'S THE NEXT VOICE YOU HEAR!

Replied on Fri, Dec 18, 2015 at 12:49 PM CST + 1
JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING Fair Grove, MO 610 Posts, 0 +, 1 -	JASON WEAST FAIR GROVE TRUCKING - Fair Grove, MO Originally Posted by: MARK YORK Quote: "I just started in this business. Like every other business, there's money to be made...otherwise, none of us would be here. The old adage is true, "You have to spend money to make money"...but I like to spend as little as absolutely necessary and make as much as possible. DUH! I joined NASTC National Association of Small Trucking Companies. I went to their NAST class a couple weeks before my truck hit the road...New Entrant Survival Training...GLAD I DID! I learned a lot. There was a guy in there with 40 years trucking experience. He said he wished he would have taken that class 40 years ago...gave me hope that my road will be a bit easier to start down. The statistics say...well, they say pretty much whatever the statusticians want them to say...BUT, the stats say 15% of new entrants survive past the first year. A whopping 85% of new entrants who take the NAST class survive past the first year! Dave, the founder, personally conducts the class. He spends a lot of his other time in Washington. He had a fairly big hand in getting the CSA Data removed from the public eye. That's been on his hit list for years and he and some others have hammered it hard enough Washington had to listen. Good for them. Anywho...If you want to be part of an organization that is all about helping the small trucking company, check them out www.nastc.com OH, don't forget the NASTC FleetOne fuel card. I've been saving between 50 and 70 cents per gallon at TA/Pilot! Pays for the $250 yearly membership in about 2 weeks. They have a bunch of other stuff like software to run your company, keep track of all your loads and drivers, payroll, lane estimates, quarterly filings, yearly filings, driver's expiration dates, all kinds of stuff. The fuel card is the bait to get you in, then the toy box is wide open...dig in! AND YOU NEVER GET AN ANSWERING MACHINE...EVER! CALL THEM AND A PERSON ANSWERS...YOU WANT TO TALK TO DAVE, JUST ASK, HE'S THE NEXT VOICE YOU HEAR!" Scott correct me if I'm wrong with this guy sounds like an unemployed TQL broker what a doink

Replied on Fri, Dec 18, 2015 at 12:49 PM CST

+ 1

JASON WEAST

FAIR GROVE TRUCKING

Fair Grove, MO

610 Posts, 0 +, 1 -

JASON WEAST

FAIR GROVE TRUCKING - Fair Grove, MO

Originally Posted by: MARK YORK
Quote: "I just started in this business. Like every other business, there's money to be made...otherwise, none of us would be here. The old adage is true, "You have to spend money to make money"...but I like to spend as little as absolutely necessary and make as much as possible. DUH! I joined NASTC National Association of Small Trucking Companies. I went to their NAST class a couple weeks before my truck hit the road...New Entrant Survival Training...GLAD I DID! I learned a lot. There was a guy in there with 40 years trucking experience. He said he wished he would have taken that class 40 years ago...gave me hope that my road will be a bit easier to start down. The statistics say...well, they say pretty much whatever the statusticians want them to say...BUT, the stats say 15% of new entrants survive past the first year. A whopping 85% of new entrants who take the NAST class survive past the first year! Dave, the founder, personally conducts the class. He spends a lot of his other time in Washington. He had a fairly big hand in getting the CSA Data removed from the public eye. That's been on his hit list for years and he and some others have hammered it hard enough Washington had to listen. Good for them. Anywho...If you want to be part of an organization that is all about helping the small trucking company, check them out www.nastc.com OH, don't forget the NASTC FleetOne fuel card. I've been saving between 50 and 70 cents per gallon at TA/Pilot! Pays for the $250 yearly membership in about 2 weeks. They have a bunch of other stuff like software to run your company, keep track of all your loads and drivers, payroll, lane estimates, quarterly filings, yearly filings, driver's expiration dates, all kinds of stuff. The fuel card is the bait to get you in, then the toy box is wide open...dig in! AND YOU NEVER GET AN ANSWERING MACHINE...EVER! CALL THEM AND A PERSON ANSWERS...YOU WANT TO TALK TO DAVE, JUST ASK, HE'S THE NEXT VOICE YOU HEAR!"

Scott correct me if I'm wrong with this guy sounds like an unemployed TQL broker what a doink

Replied on Fri, Dec 25, 2015 at 09:24 AM CST + 1
DEAN STEINEL STEINEL ENTERPRISES RANDOLPH, OH 47 Posts, 13 +, 2 -	DEAN STEINEL STEINEL ENTERPRISES - RANDOLPH, OH Everyone wants a fuel card. What a bunch of crap. My visa card is just as good as another piece of plastic but the truckstops seem to think they need to try to rip me off for another 5-6 cpg. Then I get stuck behind these clowns trying to pay for their fuel with all this nonsense, cash advances, pay with 2-3 or more types of payments. Screw that. Screw paying to load a card. Screw paying for every transaction. Screw the card not working and these guys holding me up fo 20 minutes trying to get it to work. I buy almost all my fuel at a Speedway or place that doesn't want to rip me off. I like to stay away from the big stops anyway because thats where all the big companies go

Replied on Fri, Dec 25, 2015 at 09:24 AM CST

+ 1

DEAN STEINEL

STEINEL ENTERPRISES

RANDOLPH, OH

47 Posts, 13 +, 2 -

DEAN STEINEL

STEINEL ENTERPRISES - RANDOLPH, OH

Everyone wants a fuel card. What a bunch of crap. My visa card is just as good as another piece of plastic but the truckstops seem to think they need to try to rip me off for another 5-6 cpg. Then I get stuck behind these clowns trying to pay for their fuel with all this nonsense, cash advances, pay with 2-3 or more types of payments. Screw that. Screw paying to load a card. Screw paying for every transaction. Screw the card not working and these guys holding me up fo 20 minutes trying to get it to work. I buy almost all my fuel at a Speedway or place that doesn't want to rip me off. I like to stay away from the big stops anyway because thats where all the big companies go

Replied on Sat, Dec 26, 2015 at 10:46 AM CST
HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC Wendell, MN 108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -	HOWARD RASMUSSEN RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN What does a fuel card have to do with the topic of this forum? Just sayin.....

Replied on Mon, Jan 04, 2016 at 12:14 PM CST

TODD NEYRINCK

DDW INVESTMENTS LLC

Tecumseh, MI

13 Posts, 4 +, 1 -

TODD NEYRINCK

DDW INVESTMENTS LLC - Tecumseh, MI

Hard to believe this is all of the feedback that this subject has brought on in a perfect world provisions woud have to be put in for border wait times weather and construction delays but I am not sure how the government would react to getting a bill that is documented via ELOG for waiting time at the border or road construction delay but I think that would be a start after all Obama care has worked out so well for all of us..This is a start maybe the politicians can figure how to make plants run on time for production and receivers who bring in materials in an as needed basis to change the way they operate there business all things that are going to have to be addressed.

Replied on Mon, Jan 04, 2016 at 12:34 PM CST

JARVIS DALLMAN

DALLMAN TRUCKING

Wells, MN

1 Posts, 0 +, 0 -

JARVIS DALLMAN

DALLMAN TRUCKING - Wells, MN

the only reason for this is NOT SAFETY its to make revenue EASIER to get from the company as the DOT will be all over this.. its really sad how many hoops we as drivers and company owners have to jump through just to drive.. and as far as the no ELD needed on 2000 or older? WTH?!! that makes zero sense, this trucking world is so f**d up anymore, getting harder and harder to continue... best of luck everyone

Replied on Mon, Jan 04, 2016 at 01:26 PM CST

JERRY BECK

BECK BULK

HANKAMER, TX

513 Posts, 47 +, 5 -

JERRY BECK

BECK BULK - HANKAMER, TX

Originally Posted by: KEVIN TURNER
Quote: "We all need to call are reps and senators and tell them this is just can not happen!!"

I've been writing and calling both of our useless senators and my congressman every week for over a year to complain about this.

Cornyn tells me he has to do what is best for everyone and Cruz only sends me a letter whining for campaign donations. My congressman has never replied.

Replied on Mon, Jan 04, 2016 at 09:43 PM CST

MATT DUES

DUES TRUCKING

FORT RECOVERY, OH

17 Posts, 3 +, 2 -

MATT DUES

DUES TRUCKING - FORT RECOVERY, OH

Originally Posted by: JERRY BECK
Quote: "I've been writing and calling both of our useless senators and my congressman every week for over a year to complain about this. Cornyn tells me he has to do what is best for everyone and Cruz only sends me a letter whining for campaign donations. My congressman has never replied."

What are some of the key points you hit on in these letters? Haven't sent any in for myself and just wondering what kind of things people are putting in them for a little guidance? Thanks in advance!

Replied on Mon, Jan 04, 2016 at 09:56 PM CST

JERRY BECK

BECK BULK

HANKAMER, TX

513 Posts, 47 +, 5 -

JERRY BECK

BECK BULK - HANKAMER, TX

Matt I just tell them the cost of compliance and the cost is prohibitive to my mom & pop operation.

I also tell Sen Cornyn's front man that during 40+ years of driving I've had no accidents and don't see why he thinks e-logs would make me more safe.

Cruze is a pure asshole. Instead of listening to why you've called his office his people start hitting on you for campaign donations. Then I get letters from him begging for money.. He wants money worse than a televangelist.

Replied on Tue, Jan 05, 2016 at 07:45 AM CST + 1
DUANE STUTZMAN S AND G FARMS SCRANTON , AR 22 Posts, 1 +, 0 -	DUANE STUTZMAN S AND G FARMS - SCRANTON , AR It's our own fault. We should have put our foot down a long time ago. And the ones that wouldn't stop. Make them. All I can say now. Is to call your rep. And join OOida. The government has no right telling us what to do.

Replied on Tue, Jan 05, 2016 at 02:25 PM CST + 1
JEFF PEARSON C & R TRUCKING INC PAYSON, UT 928 Posts, 225 +, 94 -	JEFF PEARSON C & R TRUCKING INC - PAYSON, UT If this is a mandate.. Its not a law.. What would happen if we werent good little boys and girls and said NO. What could they do? Im sure we all want to legal little children.. But there is a time and place to not be.. They had a court decision a few years ago that said no Electronic log books..

Replied on Tue, Jan 05, 2016 at 03:35 PM CST

+ 1

DANIEL CORBIN

LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC

COLUMBIA, NC

210 Posts, 181 +, 22 -

DANIEL CORBIN

LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC - COLUMBIA, NC

Originally Posted by: JEFF PEARSON
Quote: "If this is a mandate.. Its not a law.. What would happen if we werent good little boys and girls and said NO. What could they do? Im sure we all want to legal little children.. But there is a time and place to not be.. They had a court decision a few years ago that said no Electronic log books.. "

I guess they would right you a ticket. Maybe treaten you with fines or to take away your authority, tags, ect. Maybe claim your a terrorist and put you in prision.

"If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so." Thomas Jefferson

Replied on Tue, Jan 05, 2016 at 04:22 PM CST
DEAN HUGHSON WALK-WAY TRANSPORT WINTHROP, IA 183 Posts, 53 +, 27 -	DEAN HUGHSON WALK-WAY TRANSPORT - WINTHROP, IA Originally Posted by: DANIEL CORBIN Quote: " I guess they would right you a ticket. Maybe treaten you with fines or to take away your authority, tags, ect. Maybe claim your a terrorist and put you in prision. "If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so." Thomas Jefferson" VERY GOOD!!

Replied on Tue, Jan 05, 2016 at 04:30 PM CST

JERRY BECK

BECK BULK

HANKAMER, TX

513 Posts, 47 +, 5 -

JERRY BECK

BECK BULK - HANKAMER, TX

In their "mandate" means the dept was given authority to enforce the rule.

Replied on Tue, Jan 05, 2016 at 04:39 PM CST

JASON WEAST

FAIR GROVE TRUCKING

Fair Grove, MO

610 Posts, 0 +, 1 -

JASON WEAST

FAIR GROVE TRUCKING - Fair Grove, MO

Originally Posted by: JERRY BECK
Quote: "In their "mandate" means the dept was given authority to enforce the rule. "

I keep on getting phone calls about buying one and using someones service to keep me legal. I'm gonna keep cool until I start getting letters stating they will do their dirty , if I don't play nice in the sandbox. I don't wanna be called a domestic terrorist if I start being, umm, well u know

Replied on Tue, Jan 05, 2016 at 04:59 PM CST

DAVID MOSHER

DAVID H MOSHER AND SONS TRUCKING

SWANSEA, MA

61 Posts, 18 +, 4 -

DAVID MOSHER

DAVID H MOSHER AND SONS TRUCKING - SWANSEA, MA

Originally Posted by: DUANE STUTZMAN
Quote: "It's our own fault. We should have put our foot down a long time ago. And the ones that wouldn't stop. Make them. All I can say now. Is to call your rep. And join OOida. The government has no right telling us what to do. "

WEneed to support OOIDA. 3millon drivers will be affected by this mandate. Yet only 200,000 drivers care about whar happens in D.C by being members of OOIDA. We need to get the member ship numbers up close to 3millon. OOIDA is our only voice in D.C. I constantly hear drivers bitch about all these changing laws and mandates after the fact. Politician only know numbers. get our numbers up and they will listen.

Replied on Tue, Jan 05, 2016 at 05:39 PM CST

+ 1

ALFRED JORDAN

POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC

PECULIAR, MO

1189 Posts, 207 +, 6 -

ALFRED JORDAN

POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC - PECULIAR, MO

OOIDA is the lobbying arm for the Independent's, join and support them for that, I agree. Not being jealous here but did anybody besides me ever wonder how they got that Multi Million dollar building from just memberships? I know that they sell insurance and other things as well, we have there hats, jackets and the like. Very good organization to have lobby for us, but if you want the real power of leverage then you need to band together like brothers and sisters and utilize the leverage of our numbers to better the industry as a whole.

This is why I and others formed the Independent Carrier Group, to do just that. We believe that we can once again take back our freedom with integrity. Bickering amongst ourselves is not resolving the issues. Blaming others without doing something about it is not solving the issues. We must work at this from several different angles. Joining OOIDA is on angle, by letting them tie up resources through lobbying and the court rooms. Joining the Indpendent Carrier Group where we are the boots on the ground and working that angle will cause a shit in our industry as well. You can not defeat an enemy with only one angle of attack, you must come at them from many different angles. You will not defeat an enemy by announcing to them when and where you are going to attack. Many of you will ask who is our enemy? Often times it is ourselves, we choose to remain stubborn, and refuse to work to better our industry with one another. This allows others to come in and start mandating how and what we can now do. It is time for us as Independent Carriers to work together as a group and take back what is rightfully ours.

Freedom with Integrity
www.independentcarriergroup.com

Replied on Tue, Jan 05, 2016 at 06:54 PM CST

JERRY BECK

BECK BULK

HANKAMER, TX

513 Posts, 47 +, 5 -

JERRY BECK

BECK BULK - HANKAMER, TX

Originally Posted by: ALFRED JORDAN
Quote: "OOIDA is the lobbying arm for the Independent's, join and support them for that, I agree. Not being jealous here but did anybody besides me ever wonder how they got that Multi Million dollar building from just memberships? I know that they sell insurance and other things as well, we have there hats, jackets and the like. Very good organization to have lobby for us, but if you want the real power of leverage then you need to band together like brothers and sisters and utilize the leverage of our numbers to better the industry as a whole. This is why I and others formed the Independent Carrier Group, to do just that. We believe that we can once again take back our freedom with integrity. Bickering amongst ourselves is not resolving the issues. Blaming others without doing something about it is not solving the issues. We must work at this from several different angles. Joining OOIDA is on angle, by letting them tie up resources through lobbying and the court rooms. Joining the Indpendent Carrier Group where we are the boots on the ground and working that angle will cause a shit in our industry as well. You can not defeat an enemy with only one angle of attack, you must come at them from many different angles. You will not defeat an enemy by announcing to them when and where you are going to attack. Many of you will ask who is our enemy? Often times it is ourselves, we choose to remain stubborn, and refuse to work to better our industry with one another. This allows others to come in and start mandating how and what we can now do. It is time for us as Independent Carriers to work together as a group and take back what is rightfully ours. Freedom with Integrity www.independentcarriergroup.com"

Amen brother. I've been a member for years so I went ahead and got a lifetime membership.

I like being able to talk to lawyers and/or tax advisors when I want to. Plus thattOOIDA is the only people trying to help fight the givermint take over.

Replied on Wed, Jan 06, 2016 at 06:27 PM CST
JERRY BECK BECK BULK HANKAMER, TX 513 Posts, 47 +, 5 -	JERRY BECK BECK BULK - HANKAMER, TX I ran across this today. .http://www.overdriveonline.com/ooida-petitions-federal-court-to-block-eld-mandate/?utm_medium=single_article&utm_campaign=site_click&utm_source=in_story_promotion

Replied on Wed, Jan 06, 2016 at 08:49 PM CST

TROY JEFFERS

BONJO ENTERPRISES LLC

NORTH PLATTE, NE

262 Posts, 32 +, 13 -

TROY JEFFERS

BONJO ENTERPRISES LLC - NORTH PLATTE, NE

This is funny.... "Note to self" - this is a law and dec 16 2016 it will be inforced, unless debunked in court, good luck, they don't send you letters when they change hours of service, they give you fines and shut you down when you get stopped. I talk to guys that have no clue what the new law is??- it's in the regestrie , what good is calling your senator when they already passed the law??? They lost in court with the ooida that's why they just took two years to rewrite the whole thing- so they don't get beat in court again and the ata is pushing all this shit, not Obama, so good luck with your 10-15 thousand dollar fine -and tow bill when you get pulled in, they want us gone- rant off and no offense to anyone just my two cents

Replied on Wed, Jan 06, 2016 at 08:50 PM CST

TROY JEFFERS

BONJO ENTERPRISES LLC

NORTH PLATTE, NE

262 Posts, 32 +, 13 -

TROY JEFFERS

BONJO ENTERPRISES LLC - NORTH PLATTE, NE

This is funny.... "Note to self" - this is a law and dec 16 2017 it will be inforced, unless debunked in court, good luck, they don't send you letters when they change hours of service, they give you fines and shut you down when you get stopped. I talk to guys that have no clue what the new law is??- it's in the regestrie , what good is calling your senator when they already passed the law??? They lost in court with the ooida that's why they just took two years to rewrite the whole thing- so they don't get beat in court again and the ata is pushing all this shit, not Obama, so good luck with your 10-15 thousand dollar fine -and tow bill when you get pulled in, they want us gone- rant off and no offense to anyone just my two cents

Replied on Thu, Jan 07, 2016 at 06:08 AM CST

DEAN STEINEL

STEINEL ENTERPRISES

RANDOLPH, OH

47 Posts, 13 +, 2 -

DEAN STEINEL

STEINEL ENTERPRISES - RANDOLPH, OH

It is a mandate now. It will become a law December of 2017. The only ones fighting this are the ooida. I really don't see them getting anywhere with it. Too many people either want us to have them or dont care. I've got a 97 so I'm not getting them anyway. This has been going on for a long time. Its too late now. The NRA has way more members than the OOIDA does and they are not getting anywhere with the government trying to kill the 2nd amendment. Do you really think that the government cares about us

Replied on Thu, Jan 07, 2016 at 08:11 AM CST

SCOTT BARRAZA

BARRAZA TRUCKING

SANDIA, TX

12 Posts, 0 +, 0 -

SCOTT BARRAZA

BARRAZA TRUCKING - SANDIA, TX

We're doing the wait and see at the moment. We run intrastate in TX and right now we run under a different set of rules than interstate. We're allowed 15hrs on duty, 12 hrs driving and 8 hrs offduty/sleeper berth before coming back on duty. basiclly the old rules for interstate. when we don't run a log book we have to be back to our terminal in 12 hrs and not exceed 150 air mile radius from home terminal. If Texas doesn't change and the DOT don't try and nit pick interstate/intrastate we're not going to add the electronic logs, especially when we have trucks that only run during summer harvest. I suspect after the rule goes into effect we'll see the DOT scrutinizing our load origins/destinations so they can justify a log violation. they've already tried that in regards to medical cards.

Replied on Thu, Jan 07, 2016 at 10:28 AM CST

GLENN SELLHORST

MCWIESER TRUCKING

Fremont, NE

108 Posts, 3 +, 7 -

GLENN SELLHORST

MCWIESER TRUCKING - Fremont, NE

Originally Posted by: SCOTT BARRAZA
Quote: "We're doing the wait and see at the moment. We run intrastate in TX and right now we run under a different set of rules than interstate. We're allowed 15hrs on duty, 12 hrs driving and 8 hrs offduty/sleeper berth before coming back on duty. basiclly the old rules for interstate. when we don't run a log book we have to be back to our terminal in 12 hrs and not exceed 150 air mile radius from home terminal. If Texas doesn't change and the DOT don't try and nit pick interstate/intrastate we're not going to add the electronic logs, especially when we have trucks that only run during summer harvest. I suspect after the rule goes into effect we'll see the DOT scrutinizing our load origins/destinations so they can justify a log violation. they've already tried that in regards to medical cards."

We have the same thing in Nebeaska called county commercial which is a BIG JOKE as many are abusing the shit out of it!

Replied on Fri, Jan 08, 2016 at 04:24 PM CST

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC

Wendell, MN

108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN

Originally Posted by: DANIEL CORBIN
Quote: "Not trying to be a smart ass. But how's that work? Wouldn't you split the miles/pay? "

Not sure what you mean, we are husband and wife. He drives and I drive. Yes we will split the miles and I get the paycheck (hahaha). The good thing is we don't have to park the truck to avoid the HOS because we only run about 14 to 15 hours per day. We switch drivers when one of us has reached our HOS so we don't violate anything.

Replied on Fri, Jan 08, 2016 at 05:06 PM CST

ALFRED JORDAN

POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC

PECULIAR, MO

1189 Posts, 207 +, 6 -

ALFRED JORDAN

POWERHOUSE TRANSPORTATION, LLC - PECULIAR, MO

Originally Posted by: HOWARD RASMUSSEN
Quote: "Not sure what you mean, we are husband and wife. He drives and I drive. Yes we will split the miles and I get the paycheck (hahaha). The good thing is we don't have to park the truck to avoid the HOS because we only run about 14 to 15 hours per day. We switch drivers when one of us has reached our HOS so we don't violate anything."

Good one Val, at least you drive the miles. When I am running, I drive the miles and my wife still gets the paycheck. (HaHaHa).

On the serious not she makes her own money as well, I would not want to belittle her.

Replied on Fri, Jan 08, 2016 at 05:50 PM CST

DANIEL CORBIN

LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC

COLUMBIA, NC

210 Posts, 181 +, 22 -

DANIEL CORBIN

LOST HIGHWAY TRUCKING LLC - COLUMBIA, NC

That would work great for husband wife team. I just find it funny when people tell me they run team so they make more becouse they get more miles. They may double miles or get more loads, but there's two to spit the check. I'm glad that the two of you can work together.

Replied on Sun, Jan 10, 2016 at 05:59 AM CST
MICHEL NELLSCH R2 TRUCKING Addison, AL 1 Posts, 1 +, 1 -	MICHEL NELLSCH R2 TRUCKING - Addison, AL Im just glad i drive a 98 classic xl. Loose leaf til i die

Replied on Sun, Jan 10, 2016 at 03:18 PM CST

+ 1

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC

Wendell, MN

108 Posts, 9 +, 2 -

HOWARD RASMUSSEN

RAZZ TRUCKING LLC - Wendell, MN

Originally Posted by: ALFRED JORDAN
Quote: "Good one Val, at least you drive the miles. When I am running, I drive the miles and my wife still gets the paycheck. (HaHaHa). On the serious not she makes her own money as well, I would not want to belittle her."

I actually enjoy driving so learning to drive the semi was a no-brainer for me. I also handle all the books for our business and do a lot of booking loads when we are not busy with the company we steadily run for.

Kudos to your wife!

Replied on Tue, Jan 12, 2016 at 09:18 PM CST

MATT DUES

DUES TRUCKING

FORT RECOVERY, OH

17 Posts, 3 +, 2 -

MATT DUES

DUES TRUCKING - FORT RECOVERY, OH

If most newer trucks are going to be required to be equipped with elogs, what are the truck dealers going to do with the non compliant inventory on their lots? Are they supposed to have the equipment installed when they already have a fixed margin or will the guy buying the truck have to make it compliant? Just wondering if this will affect more than just the independents like most of us?

Replied on Wed, Sep 27, 2017 at 11:07 PM CST
DUANE STUTZMAN S AND G FARMS SCRANTON , AR 22 Posts, 1 +, 0 -	DUANE STUTZMAN S AND G FARMS - SCRANTON , AR Im going to keep trucking. Give me a tickit. Dont care. Its not right to punish someone that has a perfect CSA score

Replied on Wed, Sep 27, 2017 at 11:15 PM CST - 2
TROY JEFFERS BONJO ENTERPRISES LLC NORTH PLATTE, NE 262 Posts, 32 +, 13 -	TROY JEFFERS BONJO ENTERPRISES LLC - NORTH PLATTE, NE Originally Posted by: DUANE STUTZMAN Quote: "Im going to keep trucking. Give me a tickit. Dont care. Its not right to punish someone that has a perfect CSA score" Bahahah!!! And I will be laughing when they shut your azz down at the scale house for a week tell you install it, plus the huge fine

Replied on Thu, Sep 28, 2017 at 06:32 AM CST

KEVIN TURNER

A&R BULKTRANSPORT

Manito, IL

28 Posts, 0 +, 0 -

KEVIN TURNER

A&R BULKTRANSPORT - Manito, IL

As long as you stay with in 150 air miles and don't cross a state line and are out and back in 12 hour you do not have to run a log book. Then you are ok to cross state lines as long as you stay with in 100 air miles and are out and back in 12 hours you do not have to run a log book!!! You can also go from time sheets to logs and back. So say today you are outside that 100 and 150 air miles you run the log or elog and tomorrow you are in the 100 or 150 air miles you can run time sheet. You do not have to run one or the other.

Replied on Thu, Sep 28, 2017 at 08:50 AM CST

DUANE STUTZMAN

S AND G FARMS

SCRANTON , AR

22 Posts, 1 +, 0 -

DUANE STUTZMAN

S AND G FARMS - SCRANTON , AR

Originally Posted by: DUANE STUTZMAN
Quote: "Im going to keep trucking. Give me a tickit. Dont care. Its not right to punish someone that has a perfect CSA score"

And you will be the first one to run and go get an e log in yourtruck goes to show what you know they're not putting people out of service or just given a ticket I'm going to stand up for my rights you ain't nothing but a chickenshit moron

Replied on Thu, Sep 28, 2017 at 08:52 AM CST + 1
DUANE STUTZMAN S AND G FARMS SCRANTON , AR 22 Posts, 1 +, 0 -	DUANE STUTZMAN S AND G FARMS - SCRANTON , AR Goes to show what you know they're not putting people out of service they're giving tickets laugh all you want but you'll probably be the first chickenshit to run and putting a log in your truck why don't you take a set of balls and stand up for your rights moron

Replied on Thu, Sep 28, 2017 at 02:53 PM CST
CHET ROTH SOMERSET LANDSCAPING SERVICES South Bound Brook, NJ 26 Posts, 0 +, 1 -	CHET ROTH SOMERSET LANDSCAPING SERVICES - South Bound Brook, NJ Just dont listen to the government.stand up to them. Im not spendingthat money. If they want e longs in my truck which is a2000 with a y in Serial # then they can pay for it and stop paying off all the mega co.let congress take a pay cut

Replied on Thu, Sep 28, 2017 at 09:45 PM CST

- 1

TROY JEFFERS

BONJO ENTERPRISES LLC

NORTH PLATTE, NE

262 Posts, 32 +, 13 -

TROY JEFFERS

BONJO ENTERPRISES LLC - NORTH PLATTE, NE

Originally Posted by: DUANE STUTZMAN
Quote: "And you will be the first one to run and go get an e log in yourtruck goes to show what you know they're not putting people out of service or just given a ticket I'm going to stand up for my rights you ain't nothing but a chickenshit moron"

You have just proven my point, that any retard can own a truck.... bahahah!

Replied on Fri, Sep 29, 2017 at 08:16 AM CST

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING

CLEARWATER, MN

794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN

More than 70 years ago, America entered the Second World War, to stop the rise of fascism. Arlington national cemetery is full of our family members, as well as many others, to remind us of that. This ELD mandate is proof that we no longer have a free enterprise system of government, but rather a fascist one. In a free enterprise system, the market place would of determined the fate of the ELD.... Instead we had some Eliteist's from a couple of big companies stroll up to Capitol Hill, and write a check out to our lawmakers, to shove this down our throat. The merging of corporate and state interest=Fascism. As we speak our police departments are arming themselves with rocket launchers, armored personnel carriers, machine guns, and other military hardware.... We are building walls on our borders. Wall's can be used to keep people in, as well as out! Our government now bans us from traveling to many other countries. Many of you have already been mentally conditioned to accept this. If you think I am wrong, just look around at all of the people who are saying how great this mandate is? They don't even realize that they are supporting Fascism. Can you guess what come next? I bet a hollacaust survivor could.

Replied on Fri, Sep 29, 2017 at 05:53 PM CST
ROSE PFLUGER ROAD WARRIORS TRANSPORTATION INC MORRISTOWN, AZ 654 Posts, 9 +, 4 -	ROSE PFLUGER ROAD WARRIORS TRANSPORTATION INC - MORRISTOWN, AZ Im astounded at how many are blindly accepting this Art Pfluger

Replied on Sat, Sep 30, 2017 at 02:27 PM CST

+ 2

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING

CLEARWATER, MN

794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN

Originally Posted by: ROSE PFLUGER
Quote: "Im astounded at how many are blindly accepting this Art Pfluger"

Art, this mandate is depressing, but it's not nearly as depressing as the bigger picture, the Rise of Fascism in America. We are a step away from government run health care, and two steps away from government run transportation. The public has surrendered their sovereignty to the government, and their children's future. Just look at how the establishment has convinced the people that government can replace the parents? Most working people have shipped their children off to daycare, and trust government run schools to replace the role of the parent. Where they are brainwashed to think that everything that made America great, is what is wrong with America. How many of these millenials even know who carl Marx, Joseph stallin, or pollpot was? Or Mussolini and Adolph hitler? And how these folks came to power? The people supporting the ELD mandate are no different from the brown shirts, that gave rise to Adolph hitler. Today it's your property rights they take, and tomorrow it's your religion. As we speak, there are those in Washington discussing hate speech laws..... And these same politicians are putting pressure on Facebook, to censor free speech. So you will have state run media, just like North Korea. An ATA wet dream . I have come to belief that the war between heaven and Hell is being played out in front of us, as the Bible for told.

Replied on Sun, Oct 01, 2017 at 08:23 AM CST

+ 1

SCOTT LANGSTON

LANSCO LLC

Farmington, MO

3 Posts, 4 +, 0 -

SCOTT LANGSTON

LANSCO LLC - Farmington, MO

It is true you will drive when sleepy and forced to sleep when you are not. My insurance has doubled because of more trucks wrecks they say. i did some digging on those statistics and 80%were from companys with ELD's more than 100 trucks and drivers with less than 2 yr's experience. I have experienced ELD's first hand and I have never driven more careless and agressive and tired in all my years of trucking. The 14 hr clock will ruin trucking for the little guy.The trucking industry will suffer for sure I just hope I can survive it.

Replied on Sun, Oct 01, 2017 at 06:44 PM CST

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING

CLEARWATER, MN

794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN

A few years ago, Domino's pizza used to advertise 30 miniutes or less, or it's free on their TV commercials.... Then the lawyers got involved after some serious accident's, and used that to nail their ass to the cross, successfully making the case in court, that putting the driver up against the clock contributed to the accident, because it "pressured the driver to engage in risky behavior." So there is already a precident established in the courts, that can be applied to this. I would like to see some lawyers file a class action lawsuit against the ATA, and hold them accountable, since this mandate can clearly be traced back to them. If they had not lobbied congress for this mandate, it never would have happened. What I find funny is that the Florida state trucking association supported this mandate, and then the hurricane hit, and turned most of their trucks into submarines, and now they want to be exempted from they're own mandate? Hymmm.

Replied on Mon, Oct 02, 2017 at 04:41 PM CST + 1
ROSE PFLUGER ROAD WARRIORS TRANSPORTATION INC MORRISTOWN, AZ 654 Posts, 9 +, 4 -	ROSE PFLUGER ROAD WARRIORS TRANSPORTATION INC - MORRISTOWN, AZ Why are all so willing to lay down their freedom and right to choice? What is the point if it's down to a total herd mentality? This is the most unsafe device ever. You be forced to choose between a decent living or driving when you're tired and it goes on from there. Art Pfluger

Replied on Mon, Oct 02, 2017 at 10:02 PM CST

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING

CLEARWATER, MN

794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN

I have received a ton of phone calls from people, thanking me for being so vocal in opposing this mandate. Many have told me that they are afraid to speak out publicly, for various reasons. Now some of them are starting to realize, that this isn't going to go away on it's own. Many of them are now watching there drivers quit, and get out of the industry. And they are unable to find any replacements. One company near me, forced all of their office help to go and get CDL's recently, because they cannot find any drivers! They were told that they would only have to fill in occasionally. Most have now been driving steady for the last two months. Their office is empty now, and they are asking their employees to come in on their days off, and do office work. There is a company that specializes in hauling dirt, less than 30 miles away from me, who has had a sign out by their driveway all summer, that reads " no cdl needed to apply, we offer training"......and they have not been able to find anyone...but you don't see rates going up, despite this.

Replied on Mon, Oct 02, 2017 at 10:29 PM CST

+ 1 - 1

ROSE PFLUGER

ROAD WARRIORS TRANSPORTATION INC

MORRISTOWN, AZ

654 Posts, 9 +, 4 -

ROSE PFLUGER

ROAD WARRIORS TRANSPORTATION INC - MORRISTOWN, AZ

Mr. Winters for the most part we are on the same page. My trucks serve the dairy industry. In conjunction with my customer we spoke to these buyers. They will not pay more for the product. The return isn't there. If I can't raise rates to offset lost production I'm done. I've raised driver wages past what is affordable. Most of my guys are older and Will leave the industry. The Outlook is very bleak and I don't see a way out or a place to hide. The wages for local drivers is down to $12-$15 per hour. They are going to drop more as these older guys stay home. I've had trucks ready on the line for 18 months without drivers.
I have no answer with the eld.

Art Pfluger

Replied on Mon, Oct 02, 2017 at 10:44 PM CST

TROY JEFFERS

BONJO ENTERPRISES LLC

NORTH PLATTE, NE

262 Posts, 32 +, 13 -

TROY JEFFERS

BONJO ENTERPRISES LLC - NORTH PLATTE, NE

Originally Posted by: ROSE PFLUGER
Quote: "Mr. Winters for the most part we are on the same page. My trucks serve the dairy industry. In conjunction with my customer we spoke to these buyers. They will not pay more for the product. The return isn't there. If I can't raise rates to offset lost production I'm done. I've raised driver wages past what is affordable. Most of my guys are older and Will leave the industry. The Outlook is very bleak and I don't see a way out or a place to hide. The wages for local drivers is down to $12-$15 per hour. They are going to drop more as these older guys stay home. I've had trucks ready on the line for 18 months without drivers. I have no answer with the eld. Art Pfluger"

A guy can make good money driving for fed ex or xpo logistics and be home every night, I know guys making 90k a year after full wage with full healthcare and vacation

Replied on Tue, Oct 03, 2017 at 04:29 AM CST
SCOTT LANGSTON LANSCO LLC Farmington, MO 3 Posts, 4 +, 0 -	SCOTT LANGSTON LANSCO LLC - Farmington, MO Originally Posted by: TROY JEFFERS Quote: "A guy can make good money driving for fed ex or xpo logistics and be home every night, I know guys making 90k a year after full wage with full healthcare and vacation " Is that what you do? is make 90k a year because the Fed-Ex guys around here dont make that. i would have to see it to believe it

Replied on Tue, Oct 03, 2017 at 07:32 AM CST

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING

CLEARWATER, MN

794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN

Originally Posted by: TROY JEFFERS
Quote: "A guy can make good money driving for fed ex or xpo logistics and be home every night, I know guys making 90k a year after full wage with full healthcare and vacation "

And yet they are having trouble finding drivers, as they are still hiring. We have some private carriers paying close to that, and they are coming up empty too. Most of the food service companies up in my neck of the woods are close to that figure.... I no longer believe it's a money issue, rather no human being wants to be regulated, and micro managed this much. 30 years ago, you could pick and choose your drivers, now they get to interview you instead. I read somewhere recently that some of the megga carriers are working on a plan, to take convicted felons out of prison, and make them into truck drivers.. What progress the megga's are making.

Replied on Tue, Oct 03, 2017 at 09:26 AM CST

TROY JEFFERS

BONJO ENTERPRISES LLC

NORTH PLATTE, NE

262 Posts, 32 +, 13 -

TROY JEFFERS

BONJO ENTERPRISES LLC - NORTH PLATTE, NE

Originally Posted by: SCOTT LANGSTON
Quote: "Is that what you do? is make 90k a year because the Fed-Ex guys around here dont make that. i would have to see it to believe it"

No I don’t, I know guys that do, it depends on the miles between hubs that you run. .62 cents a mile plus 26.30 an hour is what xpo pays after 3 years and yes Dave I agree, any little thing and they shit can you, I started in food service, now there’s a job I don’t miss, Sysco has a 5 thousand sigh on bonus right now

Replied on Tue, Oct 03, 2017 at 03:43 PM CST

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING

CLEARWATER, MN

794 Posts, 413 +, 154 -

DAVE WINTERS

DWT TRUCKING - CLEARWATER, MN

The ATA tells us that the ELD will solve the problem of detention time, yet they oppose any legislation to require that the drivers get paid hourly, or be paid for meals and rest breaks...... If the ELD is going to solve detention time, then why do they fear hourly pay so much? Unless they are full of shit? Art also makes a good point, the market can't give you what's not there.