It's like I don't even recognize this load Board or this business that should be pretty familliar after all these years

From the sounds around and history the van world is a little slow so all of the sudden you see the TQLs of the world out soliciting there services more into the market

i am coming from open deck trailers and what you are talking about (same load for different money)is terrible on truckstop and DAT load boards

Customers are going to start learning that the rate to "get the load" and the rate to "get the load done" are two completely different things.

I do understand what you're saying, but there are headaches with both. We are a carrier first, and also a broker. Both sides to the business have their own issues. The hours are not better. My son, who is the broker agent, is on the phone with our drivers and carriers at all times day and night. I know our situation might be different, but he deals with our truck breakdowns, late loads, convincing shippers that they need to pay detention (which is getting harder and harder), changing plan due to weather, breakdowns, etc, etc., etc. We have to have the money up front to pay our carriers for the loads before the shippers pay us, etc. I think your statement is way too general. There are a lot of good brokers that exist in this market who genuinely care about this industry.

How Much Does It Cost To Start A Freight Broker Business? - YouTube

Curt, I've been thinking the exact same thing for a while now, well said. I highly recommend EVERYONE listen to the Bulk--Loads--Podcast (I tried to type it slow like they say it in the introduction) regarding double brokering. That one podcast tells you all you need to know about where things stand around here.

Look at how many are out of port Neal

at least 5 so far. Begging for Canadian hauling

This Kind of Hits, I just joined Bulk Loads to find some haulers.

Was recommended by a trucker actually.

As a Broker I'll Tell you, yes I have loads if you want them. But at the same time I'd like to make money, I'll try and get you as good a rate as possible were we both make money, but at most I'll break even. I'm trying to sustain myself,customer,company, and you.

Don't be greedy with me and I wont be greedy with you. If you in Kansas Let me know.

That's co-brokering. Co-brokering is legal, and choosing to not know the difference is ignorance. There is double brokering going on, but it isn't being done by a broker giving a load to another broker that has the proper authority to move the load.

And so we are clear....I hate brokers that just re-post loads from other brokers. I called out JTA Pro earlier in this message....but with that said, what they are doing is legal. Doesn't mean that I think that it's right. That's why I started a thread that I named "The Transparency Solution", because I think it could solve some transparency issues that we have in the industry; and BL might be willing to do it.

Incorrect. As annoying as co-brokering is from a carrier standpoint, it's very much legal and has nothing to do with splitting of fees. It has everything to do with having proper broker authority and making sure all parties involved, including the shipper, are aware of what's going on.

Co-Brokering vs. Double Brokering

So let me get this straight, you're allowing a broker or broker's organization define double brokering? Seriously? Who put them in charge of defining anything? What kind of bullshit answer would you expect from a broker or brokerage group like Carrier 411 or the TIA? If you were a sheep, would you believe the wolf if he told you he had your best interest at heart? Come on, one broker plus one broker = two brokers. You don't need to be a math matician, or genius to figure this out. It may very well be legal, however, it's not ethical. Sometimes a little common sense is all that's needed to figure things out. This topic makes me.. Hell, I'm going to pour myself a bourbon... on the rocks!!!

No, it's the definition set forth by the Department of Transportation in their Code of Federal Regulations. It may be unethical to co-broker, but it is not illegal.

I love a spirited conversation. So, to that end, since you and Jomar Rodriguez bring up the FMCSA website, and the Dept. of Transportation Code of Federal Regulations, commonly referred to as the CFR, please educate me and others who are in the dark as to the "specific" code that defines "double brokering", and "co-brokering"..

Why then, if it's 25-30% off the shippers rate, just call the shipper if myou know what they are paying, and get it yourself? Am I missing something here?

Well said. Facts matter.

Thank you for taking the time to look it up for yourself. If you go back through any of my comments you will find I have NEVER said it's illegal, because I know it is perfectly legal for 27 brokers to pass a load around like a bottle of whiskey, and all take a drink.

I find it interesting that those who like to quickly refer to any of the federal regulations never seem to be able to back their response up with actual sections of the code or rules that specifically make their point a topic. I bet in your search of the official regs, you didn't find anything that specifically defined double brokering, or co-brokering for that matter. Why do you think that is when a simple Google search yields all sorts of definitions from self proclaimed experts, none of which are backed up by actual sections of the code to which they are referring? If you want the answer, I recommend listening to the Bulkloads podcast on the subject. Pay close attention to the very first thing the guest says regarding the definition of double brokering, and not key in on his actual definition. There is your answer. Then, ask yourself why is it in his best interest, of all people to define the topic, his best interest to have the definition he has about the subject.

Yes, I'm extremely confident in my responses and there is a very good reason why. While I don't propose to be an expert in anything, and can most certainly be wrong, I'm human, I do have extensive hands on experience regarding the FMCSA Regs, USC, and the CFRs outside of being a carrier. I had a life besides owning a truck for over three decades. I own hard copies of all the transportation rules, regs, and statutes, know how to use, comprehend, and apply them. When you go beyond a Google search and actually take time to read the regs, the answers are there. Everything else is useless static which is where all the misinformation starts.

Someone has had WAAAAY to much caffene today...Dave, push the coffee cup away and BREATHE...It's gonna be OK.

I would submit to you that the carrier is also a brokerage's customer, without them a broker only has half a business.

A lot of trucks do get their stuff direct and then have brokers, of late, come in & take their work from them by undercutting. A broker is not a customer. They are supposed to be a 3rd party representative that stays in contact with the customer. Some trucks need brokers, but all brokers need truckers. Everyone here "b*******" is venting, because they feel like they don't have fair representation in their own market anymore. And they are correct. Trucker unions are a joke, and the good brokers are being forced to compete with garbage brokers for lanes that they have held for years. Don't demand that people man up and not complain. We all share a first amendment right to complain when and where we want. Do I think it helps? No. But I will always stand by someone's right to do so.

I'm still waiting...🤷

So are you saying the broker isn't selling a service? It's my opinion, I'm sure others have theirs as well, that a broker is selling service to both parties. They are selling a service to shippers, and the carrier. If I as a carrier agree to take the load, then the broker is making the commission off of the load, If I don't take the load he must get someone else to cover it. I see the commission they make off the load to be what I'm willing to pay to get the load. I respect anyone's differing opinion. However, my point is, nothing happens without the carrier. Without the carrier, the shipper doesn't get his product to market, and the broker has no service of value to a shipper. I further believe, in the supply chain of today, there are those who find it in their interest to keep carriers believing they are at the bottom, and should be glad to take what they can get. My opinion of the carrier being a customer of a broker is merely an attempt to get people to look at the situation in a different way.

I totally understand which way the money flows, however I don't believe carriers are at the bottom of the food chain, especially if nothing happens without them.

Well said Barry. I get irritated when it seems some (not all) brokerages try to cheapen our work by offering quick pay for a percentage of the load. This is only a thing (factoring & quick pay) because somewhere down the line carriers began to believe they were at the bottom of the supply chain, and they should be greatful to be paid timely. I would bet most of the American public doesn't even know factoring and quick pay schemes exist, & some would be appalled to know it's common place.

BOTTOM LINE: We supply the truck, trailer, fuel cost, insurance, and our time. We are certainly not the bottom.