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These rates are jokes

Feb 02, 2020 at 08:10 AM CST
+ 26 - 6
I haven’t seen a load yet posted over 1.80/mile lmao. No wonder freight is cheap, there’s clowns out there willing to haul it just to break even . Guess I’ll let the flatbed sit and keep dragging my bucket
Replied on Mon, Feb 03, 2020 at 08:29 PM CST
+ 1

I saw one posted for 1.22 today.

Replied on Tue, Feb 04, 2020 at 07:44 AM CST
Also, why do these people wait until there is a big wind/snow/weather event and THEN want to move a load?

Art Pfluger
Replied on Tue, Feb 04, 2020 at 07:44 AM CST
+ 1
These rates will continue to be a joke as long as some of these people continue to haul this crap.Whats wrong with you guys,last I knew this was not a hobby it was a business,so why dont you act like it and apply some common sense to what you are doing.As for me and my family we would prefer to not have to go apply for welfare and food stamps just so we can say we run a business,I am really surprised that some of you have not offered to pay,some of these guys for the privelage of hauling their garbage!!!!!!!!!!!!
Replied on Tue, Feb 04, 2020 at 09:14 AM CST

But there's always this high dollar $1.12/mile load waiting to be moved..."Easy strap and go!"

Replied on Tue, Feb 04, 2020 at 12:50 PM CST
If nobody forces anyone to change their behavior why would they? If government is not going to do it, then who? Let the immigrants take trucking over, and maybe some hard hitters like MS-13 will change the way business gets done, otherwise it’s pretty clear that we indigenous people don’t have what it takes to get it done.
Replied on Tue, Feb 04, 2020 at 12:52 PM CST
+ 1
$1.12 is big money out of Az. Lot of flatbed stuff as low as $.87. There were 17 loads recently to laredo 48000 lbs full tarp $.87 they were gone in 3 days. Amazing.

Art Pfluger
Replied on Tue, Feb 04, 2020 at 01:29 PM CST
Originally Posted by: ROSE PFLUGER
Quote: "$1.12 is big money out of Az. Lot of flatbed stuff as low as $.87. There were 17 loads recently to laredo 48000 lbs full tarp $.87 they were gone in 3 days. Amazing. Art Pfluger "

That is amazing. One more reason for me to stay out of Arizona.

Replied on Tue, Feb 04, 2020 at 02:38 PM CST

David, and others, this rate situation is exactly why I proposed the idea of forming some sort of bulk drivers association a while back. This morning I had breakfast with the young man I've spoken about in the past, with his 'non-sleeper' Cascadia, who returned home last night, after running to Ohio, Michigan, and southwestern Illinois. He said his rates were so bad he only averaged about $1.60 per mile. When he asked me if I had decided to either buy another Star 5700 and Utility refer to expand my business, or get into the bulk load community, I said "not yet". When he mentioned he wanted to buy one of the new KW 990 with a 68 inch sleeper to pull his hopper, I asked him "Why? That would make your equipment heavy and you wouldn't be able to haul as much as I'm planning to haul". He asked what I was looking into and I told him a Star 4700 with a 40 inch bunk, along with the Eagle Bridge belt trailer". He said, "40 inch bunk? That's small!" I replied, "How big do you think the sleepers were in the four cabovers I've owned in the past? Look, I appreciate the fact that you want to run more legal, with a tractor with a proper sleeper, but you need to think about the weight of your equipment and haul as much as you can with loads hauled by the ton. Most drivers would love to have nice, big tractors with big sleepers, a refrigerater, and a microwave, but if you're in this business to make money, you need to really think about what you actually need to be successful. And a buck sixty a mile average is pathetic. You and your buddy's need to quit running so cheap!. His reply was, "Well, if I don't haul it someone else will". Unfortuneately, that's true.

$1.12 per mile to haul loads? Geez, these brokers have a lot of nerve! Should be tarred and feathered and run out of town on a rail. And I hope that broker reads these posts.

I've written another letter to the "experts" in Washington, again exprssing my opinion on how the H.O.S. should be fixed. Probably won't do any good; however, I'm sure they will receive similar letters from other industry "professionals" like me. What it's really going to take is a more drastic response to the situation. I don't believe in strikes, but something needs to happen. In all sectors of transportation.

Replied on Tue, Feb 04, 2020 at 04:12 PM CST
Originally Posted by: JERRY ASHLEY
Quote: "David, and others, this rate situation is exactly why I proposed the idea of forming some sort of bulk drivers association a while back. This morning I had breakfast with the young man I've spoken about in the past, with his 'non-sleeper' Cascadia, who returned home last night, after running to Ohio, Michigan, and southwestern Illinois. He said his rates were so bad he only averaged about $1.60 per mile. When he asked me if I had decided to either buy another Star 5700 and Utility refer to expand my business, or get into the bulk load community, I said "not yet". When he mentioned he wanted to buy one of the new KW 990 with a 68 inch sleeper to pull his hopper, I asked him "Why? That would make your equipment heavy and you wouldn't be able to haul as much as I'm planning to haul". He asked what I was looking into and I told him a Star 4700 with a 40 inch bunk, along with the Eagle Bridge belt trailer". He said, "40 inch bunk? That's small!" I replied, "How big do you think the sleepers were in the four cabovers I've owned in the past? Look, I appreciate the fact that you want to run more legal, with a tractor with a proper sleeper, but you need to think about the weight of your equipment and haul as much as you can with loads hauled by the ton. Most drivers would love to have nice, big tractors with big sleepers, a refrigerater, and a microwave, but if you're in this business to make money, you need to really think about what you actually need to be successful. And a buck sixty a mile average is pathetic. You and your buddy's need to quit running so cheap!. His reply was, "Well, if I don't haul it someone else will". Unfortuneately, that's true. $1.12 per mile to haul loads? Geez, these brokers have a lot of nerve! Should be tarred and feathered and run out of town on a rail. And I hope that broker reads these posts. I've written another letter to the "experts" in Washington, again exprssing my opinion on how the H.O.S. should be fixed. Probably won't do any good; however, I'm sure they will receive similar letters from other industry "professionals" like me. What it's really going to take is a more drastic response to the situation. I don't believe in strikes, but something needs to happen. In all sectors of transportation. "

I still like your co-op idea and I still am willing to help however I can. A network of trusted carriers are much needed.

Mr. Young Man certainly has a valid point. Someone will indeed run it. Especially if it's a carrier that has something lined up on a both ways type of deal. Like getting $1.60 one way to get to his $2.40 on the reverse so then he's getting $2/mile on the trip total. Or maybe the carrier already got his round trip rate he needed from the start and the $1.12/mile rate is essentially free revenue for his "back haul". And of course, you have the driver out there that lives in the truck, has no personal bills, has very little business overhead and eats canned foods from the sleeper for his three hots and a cot that none of us can compete with. In my mind I always default to this vision of the port roach hauling with his nasty dirty truck, it's bald tires, duct tape and hand written DOT numbers on paper stuck to the door in my head when I see those rates.

However, that certainly isn't always the case. Have you seen this LaneHoney yet? I've posted a link below. Dave, posted this in another thread and it certainly caught my attention. For the lanes I'm most familiar with the numbers are very close. Ironically, they aren't gouging by any means. My rates are about 25-30 percent lower than the shippers rates are. I had my flatbed posted today and my phone was blowing up. So many brokers called and hung up upset with me after hearing my rate quotes. It's insulting to have a complete stranger sitting behind a desk who has no part of MY business whatsoever interrogate me as to why I charge so much. If we were face to face I doubt I would have been able to hold my composure. The industry is cyclical. The capacity is high right now but it won't last. Soon it will be the carrier's market again once many of the bottom feeders get that final major breakdown that seals their "business" fate.

www.lanehoney.com

Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 07:08 AM CST
+ 4

I'm not sure about east of Ne, Ia,and Ks, but the biggest problem here is the big farmers all have trucks and better ones than I do. So in the winter when they have nothing to do it's sad but it is a hobby. So they will haul for anything just to get out of the house. And I actually had 3 farmers at the local cafe come right out and tell how if they just make enough to pay the fuel they are ok with it. And the brokers and elevators know it. And I know I'm going to hear I'm biting the hand that feeds me, but if I owned a huge trucking company and farmed on the side and cut the rate on selling cattle and grain I would be dirt. All I'm saying is you do your job and let me do mine.

Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 07:08 AM CST
I think this is an interesting topic. Mostly because I was one of the idiots hauling cheap when I first started. It's hard to get the equity back that you lose so quickly. It's also frustrating to see people actually get upset that a carrier complains about a crap rate. In my dumb opinion it's a nasty double edged sword. I want less government in my life, but I also dont believe its capitalism to see companies prey on the inexperienced, many of whom are immigrants. A healthy wolf can take down a healthy prey, for a corny comparison. I don't know, I'm not saying I want more government, but nobody complains about regulations for predatory banking practices, as long as obama stays out of it anyway. But we're ok with letting some scumbag pay a young company 1.70 per loaded mile? As I've said before, I'm a believer in capitalism and there's always going to be winners and losers, just seems we have an unlimited supply of carriers that dont know any better and a giant pack of sick, weak wolves....as always, not broker bashing. I choose to use some brokerages even when offered direct opportunities, just scumbag venting
Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 08:03 AM CST
+ 3
Originally Posted by: BOB MORSE
Quote: " I'm not sure about east of Ne, Ia,and Ks, but the biggest problem here is the big farmers all have trucks and better ones than I do. So in the winter when they have nothing to do it's sad but it is a hobby. So they will haul for anything just to get out of the house. And I actually had 3 farmers at the local cafe come right out and tell how if they just make enough to pay the fuel they are ok with it. And the brokers and elevators know it. And I know I'm going to hear I'm biting the hand that feeds me, but if I owned a huge trucking company and farmed on the side and cut the rate on selling cattle and grain I would be dirt. All I'm saying is you do your job and let me do mine."

Bob I dont disagree that farmers doing it cheap is bad, and I've ranted on this topic many times. My deal is this, how many brokers give loads to people with farm plates, no commercial insurance, and no operating authority? If they can afford to haul that cheap,they must not have any of the commercial requirements. So my opinion is, turn them in because its illegal.
Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 09:08 AM CST

Totally agree!!!

Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 09:10 AM CST
Originally Posted by: DALE HERMANS
Quote: "Bob I dont disagree that farmers doing it cheap is bad, and I've ranted on this topic many times. My deal is this, how many brokers give loads to people with farm plates, no commercial insurance, and no operating authority? If they can afford to haul that cheap,they must not have any of the commercial requirements. So my opinion is, turn them in because its illegal."

Yes, we've covered this before. It's not always illegal. Many operate in the gray areas and not everyone uses a broker so this gives said carriers a massive edge if used accordingly.

"Farm Plates

Farm Registration allows reduced fees for farmers who haul their own commodities in a not-for-hire operation and certain for-hire purposes. No surety bond is required. Farm Plates may be used for trucks, truck tractors and trailers used in various farming operations. Farm Vehicles may be operated out-of -state on a limited basis. Illinois Farm Registration is recognized by most states. Before entering another state, however, truck operators should check with that state.

Farm Plates may be issued to any vehicle that is used exclusively for the owner's agricultural, horticultural or livestock operations and not-for-hire. Farm Plates may also be issued to for-hire vehicles only in the transportation of seasonal, fresh, perishable fruit or vegetables from the farm to the point of first processing. An applicant is limited to five sets of plates for power units, of which only two sets of plates may exceed 59,500 pounds plus two Farm Trailer Plates.

A UCR# or USDOT # may be required if your commodity that you are moving using the Farm Plate crosses jurisdictional boundaries or is taken out of state. You may deliver to a local elevator or processing station, but if that commodity is further shipped out of state, a UCR#/USDOT# may be required. The UCR#/USDOT# is actually a USDOT number. Please contact the Illinois Commerce Commission for further information on the UCR program or contact the USDOT for information regarding the USDOT number.

Farm plates may be purchased at the Commercial and Farm Truck Division office in Springfield and Level 3 Secretary of State facilities."

https://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/departments/vehicles/cft/cft.html#farmplates

Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 09:43 AM CST
- 1

I posted a PO a job the other day that was pay by load, but if you broke down the mileage was $4 dollars a mile and I mostly (from this website) got non serious people and skeptics to respond. We're independent and so I guess you guys didn't trust us or didn't want to sign NDAs either way the job is now filled and one of my colleagues signed up 31 people in Atlanta. Now we only have stand by availability and I don't know when it'll open back up. Truckers gripe and complain about low rates, but then when a good one comes around you think it's too good to be true. Dispatchers almost always have the best rights because we get straight from shipper or negotiate from broker. Only time we accept less than 2 dollars is on back hauls to avoid dead head. FYI big companies can scam carriers just as much as small companies could! Never drive a mile without trying to verify the job is legit via, address, multiple calls to company reps, talking to other carriers or looking up job/company if listed publicly!

Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 09:50 AM CST
+ 1
David, according to fmcsa officer randy Hartley, a farmer can only haul 3500 dollars worth commercially per year on farm plates. Possible I misunderstood?
Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 09:54 AM CST
+ 1
AJ, did you just say that you accept loads under 2 dollars as a backhaul? Does the truckers expenses change based on direction he or she is driving?
Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 10:05 AM CST
Originally Posted by: DALE HERMANS
Quote: "David, according to fmcsa officer randy Hartley, a farmer can only haul 3500 dollars worth commercially per year on farm plates. Possible I misunderstood?"

Not sure, sir. That stipulation isn't mentioned in the link I've provided above nor is it found in PA, MD, DE or VA that I know of. All I can say is I don't trust law enforcement and maybe your state is different. They all have little idiosyncrasies between them. I'd get the facts from the issuing departments and go from there if I was so inlcined. My point is that one can legally haul for hire in many states on farm registrations if they're well versed, connected and determined. Some also tend to bend the rules after they've been doing it a while too. That edge simply too enticing for some it seems.

Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 10:05 AM CST
+ 1
David, the more I think I about what you said, the more I feel like a hypocrite. I'm not a farmer anymore so I have no reason to defend farmers. I may very well be wrong. The reason I'm a hypocrite is because I left my company name as Hermans farm, after quitting farming, solely for the reason that I can claim ignorance to the 7000000 dot laws a little easier
Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 10:06 AM CST
Originally Posted by: AJ W
Quote: "I posted a PO a job the other day that was pay by load, but if you broke down the mileage was $4 dollars a mile and I mostly (from this website) got non serious people and skeptics to respond. We're independent and so I guess you guys didn't trust us or didn't want to sign NDAs either way the job is now filled and one of my colleagues signed up 31 people in Atlanta. Now we only have stand by availability and I don't know when it'll open back up. Truckers gripe and complain about low rates, but then when a good one comes around you think it's too good to be true. Dispatchers almost always have the best rights because we get straight from shipper or negotiate from broker. Only time we accept less than 2 dollars is on back hauls to avoid dead head. FYI big companies can scam carriers just as much as small companies could! Never drive a mile without trying to verify the job is legit via, address, multiple calls to company reps, talking to other carriers or looking up job/company if listed publicly! "

If you want to broker freight, go get your authority and surety bond.

Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 10:22 AM CST
+ 2
Right there is a major part of the problem essentialy every load is a back haul for somebody,if the miles are the same and loads are pretty much comparable why is it that you feel that you should discount the rate,thats like going out to eat tonight and paying full price but telling the establishment you were at,when you go back tomorrow that you are only going to pay half price because you ate last night,sounds idiotic but thats exactly what you are doing.Back haul is just a term for brokers to move cheap freight or take a larger cut off of a load,in my opinion brokering should only be allowed,if you have equipment and move at minimum 50% of the freight you solicit,on your own equipment,then maybe you brokers would realize that you cant operate on the revenue that a lot of you are peddling this freight at.These rates are antiquated,I was looking at paperwork from 30 years ago and a lot of the rates were the same,or in some cases higher then than they are now.I would like to hear honest and logical justification from one of you,as to why you think this is acceptable?Go ahead speak up tell us all why,we would all love to hear it.
Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 10:55 AM CST
Originally Posted by: AJ W
Quote: "I posted a PO a job the other day that was pay by load, but if you broke down the mileage was $4 dollars a mile and I mostly (from this website) got non serious people and skeptics to respond. We're independent and so I guess you guys didn't trust us or didn't want to sign NDAs either way the job is now filled and one of my colleagues signed up 31 people in Atlanta. Now we only have stand by availability and I don't know when it'll open back up. Truckers gripe and complain about low rates, but then when a good one comes around you think it's too good to be true. Dispatchers almost always have the best rights because we get straight from shipper or negotiate from broker. Only time we accept less than 2 dollars is on back hauls to avoid dead head. FYI big companies can scam carriers just as much as small companies could! Never drive a mile without trying to verify the job is legit via, address, multiple calls to company reps, talking to other carriers or looking up job/company if listed publicly! "

Where were those 4 dollar loads going to and how many miles. 4 dollars for 50 miles isnt good at all for example. And there are places I wont go back to for 10 dollars per mile. I refuse to deal with crabbyness, laziness and time wasters. If a facility has a unexpected hiccup, a grain leg breaks or motor bearing goes out, I'll hop in and help or patiently wait because its nobody's fault. But if someone won't unload me because its 4 45 and they close at 5, I'm never going back
Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 10:55 AM CST
Bob you hit the nail directly on the head and drove it home.
Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 11:28 AM CST
Last night at the state of the union adress, all we heard was how great the economy is doing, at a time when truckers and farmers are dropping like flies, now just imagine what it would have looked like, if all of us were outside of the place, picketing and protesting, holding big signs up? Do you think the media would have been all over that? We could have used the tension between the politicians and media to our advantage, and got our side of the story covered, how we are routinely exploited and left behind, and the media would have ate it up. It’s time to go on the offensive, and make them work for us.
Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 11:28 AM CST
Originally Posted by: DALE HERMANS
Quote: "David, the more I think I about what you said, the more I feel like a hypocrite. I'm not a farmer anymore so I have no reason to defend farmers. I may very well be wrong. The reason I'm a hypocrite is because I left my company name as Hermans farm, after quitting farming, solely for the reason that I can claim ignorance to the 7000000 dot laws a little easier "

To each is own my friend. I'm certainly not judging over here. Our situations are all unique to our own operations. I was just pointing out the fact one doesn't have to be illegal to haul on farm registrations for profit and at the same time they could very well be doing it illegally. It's difficult to prove sometimes but just because it's happening doesn't mean it's illegal automatically. The Federal laws sure are out of control and seemingly impossible to follow without breaking one. I believe this is intentional so revenue can be generated for the State no matter what and under "legal" pretense whenever they feel the monetary need to shake the trucker/piggy bank.

Ultimately, this time of year rates always take a dive because not much HAS to move so the rates will reflect that and the freight volume is down but there are tons of trucks wanting to run. It's par for the course in trucking. Also, the savvy brokers know that many carriers are just looking to keep the equipment moving so they can feed their drivers/employees. Sometimes just generating revenue to keep the doors open actually keeps profit opportunities available once the weather breaks. Personally, I park if I don't get my bottom rate. I bust my ass when the getting is good to stack the deck in my favor for the Winters.

Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 01:14 PM CST
I hear what you are saying,but in the hopper industry winter is or should be the time to push up rates due to harvest being done,cattle in the feed lots and herds not being able to graze and needing to be fed suplementaly,so these cariers are just laying down and taking it in the you know what,versus pushing back,as i said before livestock and people need to eat no matter what they have to pay to move it.
Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 01:50 PM CST

Good point. Why are rates so much better in the summer then?

Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 02:22 PM CST
Because its the way these traders have these guys trained,because for a lot of segments of the trucking industry,this is a slower time of year so thats what they preach,get everybody in a frenzy and rates drop faster than a cheerleaders panties on prom night.As Nancy Reagan said just say NO.this stuff needs to move and they cant hold out very long,dont panic many bad decisions are made due to panic and being desperate.I told a trader today,when asked if I would lower my rates to cover a spread,that I do not run a charity,and that the rates are already substandard form what they should be,so yes I turned down several loads.Now I am sure somebody else jumped at them,but it is what it is there has to be a bottom,so I propose the rest of you guys follow suit,I will bet my soul if we do this,and enough of us stick together we will push these rates back up whats happening is just plain insanity and we collectively need to stop it,NOW.
Replied on Wed, Feb 05, 2020 at 03:19 PM CST
Unless you bring back blanket parties for rate cutters, it won’t change, so let’s be realistic about this, folks are going to keep doing business the same way they always have, until they go broke and take a few others down with them, and when the next big crash hits, it will be far more ugly than 2008 ever was, it will be game over for this industry, and the government will likely be taking it over. In 2008 30% of the carriers went under, the other 70% survived because high oil prices drove ethanol production and the fracking industry, but this time round that won’t be there.
Replied on Thu, Feb 06, 2020 at 07:03 AM CST
Originally Posted by: DALE HERMANS
Quote: "AJ, did you just say that you accept loads under 2 dollars as a backhaul? Does the truckers expenses change based on direction he or she is driving?"

A last resort only.

Replied on Thu, Feb 06, 2020 at 07:04 AM CST
+ 1
Originally Posted by: ERIC VOGLER
Quote: "Because its the way these traders have these guys trained,because for a lot of segments of the trucking industry,this is a slower time of year so thats what they preach,get everybody in a frenzy and rates drop faster than a cheerleaders panties on prom night.As Nancy Reagan said just say NO.this stuff needs to move and they cant hold out very long,dont panic many bad decisions are made due to panic and being desperate.I told a trader today,when asked if I would lower my rates to cover a spread,that I do not run a charity,and that the rates are already substandard form what they should be,so yes I turned down several loads.Now I am sure somebody else jumped at them,but it is what it is there has to be a bottom,so I propose the rest of you guys follow suit,I will bet my soul if we do this,and enough of us stick together we will push these rates back up whats happening is just plain insanity and we collectively need to stop it,NOW."

I half way hesitate to write this reply since I sure don't know everything, but I'm with Eric on this one. I did my civic duty last week and literally drove right past what just a month ago would have been a half way acceptable grain load going down to Lyons. Tomorrow I'll most likely drive right past another one and just take the ride down to Kanopolis for free. In the last month, the "traders" have cut the rates 5-7 cents/bu. on the origins I've called about. Believe me (or else correct me if I'm wrong) they HAVE the money. The grain, including the margin to get it moved, is contracted and I doubt seriously that has changed in a the last couple of weeks! The answer I got from a trader today was " Alot of guys are wanting to get down to Lyons". Yeah, no kidding. Notice what his answer wasn't. It wasn't "the market's down" or "feedlots aren't using as much due to the mild winter". It was simply "everybody is calling for loads down to Lyons", so I suppose the demand justifies a lower rate in their eyes.

My question is this: If you guys are willing to knock $40-50 out of the grain load down, did you get another dollar or two a ton on your salt load to make it back up? And even if you did, what was accomplished? ZERO, that's what. The salt would've paid what it takes anyway because folks are needing it. Now, from several origins, the grain isn't worth fooling with at all. If some of these deals are so tight that nobody makes anything, maybe they just don't need to happen period. Let the stuff sit. I had a broker come up $4/ton on a salt load a little while back after I said I just couldn't make it work at the rate offered- that's north of $100 on the load and they had it the whole time!

Replied on Thu, Feb 06, 2020 at 07:04 AM CST
As long as we all have to be politically correct and we NEVER actually name names, its a total waste of time. Nothing will change. If there is a time when we can call shippers and brokers out by NAME and bad practices then we might make some headway. At least maybe stop having so many hands in the pot before the truck owner. Until then this is a waste of time. Just a place to vent.
Example....you want to reduce people driving badly? Won't stop it all, but make window tint illegal. People drive like shit cause they're sure you can't identify them.

Art Pfluger
Replied on Thu, Feb 06, 2020 at 07:06 AM CST

Oh and Eric when I said you hit a nerve. I met I agree with you a 100%. Didn' want you taking that wrong.

Replied on Thu, Feb 06, 2020 at 07:07 AM CST

Eric hit a nerve of mine the person who came up with the word BACKHAUL should be strung up!!! If you haul a load from point A to point B for a good rate and the load from point B back to point A is cheap not only are you getting screwed but the first shipper is to cause he paid the good rate to get you there and now the guy on the other end gets his done for nothing?? But evidently the shippers haven't figured it out yet either. I have been doing this for 30yrs and like everything else I don't understand, this job used to be fun, it was like the military truckers were a family and had a bond, but not anymore. Anyway enough of that. I will say i'm proud of Bulk Loads because on the load board it say's view reloads not back hauls so thank you!! I also have a bull rack and I can haul 60k legally and the last 6mo it's load 65k or we don't need you, so it's been sitting since Oct, again I don't understand, maybe it's just me LOL. Anyway a lot of bad weather out there so be safe and get back to the ones that really care about you!!

Replied on Thu, Feb 06, 2020 at 07:31 AM CST

I just called on a load for a dump trailer, GA-MI, 60ton!!! That's $1.50pm! No Thanks!!

Replied on Thu, Feb 06, 2020 at 09:17 AM CST
Originally Posted by: JONATHAN DERR
Quote: "I just called on a load for a dump trailer, GA-MI, 60ton!!! That's $1.50pm! No Thanks!! "

Two years ago when the ELD hit, I pulled the pin on those long distance dump loads, and went back to doing dirt work, I make better money and get to be with my family every night, but those I talk to who stuck with it are making 30% less today and shoveling frozen loads that sat overnight in the wagon. OTR dump rates are the biggest joke ever.
Replied on Thu, Feb 06, 2020 at 09:58 AM CST

The rates are there but not thru the brokers. I have noticed many brokers have added more dispatchers, have opened up new offices in different regions ( just add a new one word to the title) and have even been interviewed and boasting about expanding and doing very well. These same brokers are adding new equipment to their co drivers. Many brokers will base the rate pm at $1.00 below the lowest fuel price they can find regardless of region. Does not matter what the commodity is - milo or wheat midds. Same rate.

And on top of this crooked issue, now the load board is being consumed by larger brokers that use to broker loads on dry/reefer freight. Now they are coming into the bulk freight and taking loads and bringing rates down even lower.

And now there are foreigners taking over the broker business, and taking loads from other brokers and driving rates down to where no one can afford to haul the load. These brokers are difficult to understand, most of the time they cannot tell you what the commodity is but they can say..only pays 1.50 pm.

Got loaded in winesburg OH, talking with the loader and he said, he had 3 trucks come in with foreigners that could not speak English and did not know how to load their trailer.

Dont take cheap freight. I noticed that when brokers take loads from other brokers and reposted the load at a much lower rate, and the load did not get covered, that second or third broker will tell the shipper the driver never showed up. Crooked business Just sayin...

Replied on Thu, Feb 06, 2020 at 10:10 AM CST
+ 3
Successful Farming just had a article about farmers getting into commercial hauling. There not making money farming so they go trucking. Somehow they got a Trump check for there losses last year with the weather related year. The trucking industry doesn't get those. Just my thoughts.
Replied on Thu, Feb 06, 2020 at 01:35 PM CST
+ 1
A lot of loads, van and flat, on a different board state driver must speak English and prove to be us citizen. Im supportive of this request.

I don't like shippers and receivers wanting to take my drivers license number or photo copy it. I thought TWIC card was supposed to take care of that but no one wants to see that

Art Pfluger
Replied on Thu, Feb 06, 2020 at 02:04 PM CST
Originally Posted by: ROSE PFLUGER
Quote: "A lot of loads, van and flat, on a different board state driver must speak English and prove to be us citizen. Im supportive of this request. I don't like shippers and receivers wanting to take my drivers license number or photo copy it. I thought TWIC card was supposed to take care of that but no one wants to see that Art Pfluger "

Most of the time those are very large steel mills with a millions rules to follow written on a thousand signs throughout the plant. Evreywhere just puts signs up written in 10 or more languages. I use my TWIC anywhere that asks for my driver's license but the only place I absolutely need it is at the Port. Nobody stores my DL anywhere. I won't let them photocopy it nor allow it to leave my hands.

Replied on Thu, Feb 06, 2020 at 03:35 PM CST
Just called on load from Nm to Az. Ready to book it from a good guy and another broker steps in and cuts it $25 a ton. Just stupid.

Art Pfluger
Replied on Thu, Feb 06, 2020 at 09:09 PM CST

I see a lot wrong with these opinions on low rates mainly because I'm young and new to the business but I will say my truck and wagon doesn't move without profiting truth is some of these high dollar rigs are taking freight cheap not for profit but for cash flow and when you roll in for a load in late model rig with nice equipment your showing you're customer your making money when in reality your working for free to have top of the line truck and trailer my opinion is "it ain't the chrome that gets you home" if it's your family and home life that matters then make it your first priority I've got less invested in my intire rig then some peoples full coverage insurance for a year but it's been all over east coast and keeps on keepin on

Replied on Fri, Feb 07, 2020 at 07:33 AM CST
Originally Posted by: KYLE VOGEL
Quote: "I see a lot wrong with these opinions on low rates mainly because I'm young and new to the business but I will say my truck and wagon doesn't move without profiting truth is some of these high dollar rigs are taking freight cheap not for profit but for cash flow and when you roll in for a load in late model rig with nice equipment your showing you're customer your making money when in reality your working for free to have top of the line truck and trailer my opinion is "it ain't the chrome that gets you home" if it's your family and home life that matters then make it your first priority I've got less invested in my intire rig then some peoples full coverage insurance for a year but it's been all over east coast and keeps on keepin on"

You have no idea what others are making and what they aren't. You're only making assumptions. Some customers only want good looking, neat and professional equipment hauling their freight. It makes a positive impression on those seeking out your services as well. Make sales visits in a unkempt beat up vehicle and it could hurt you. However, when you pull up to take the transportation manager out for lunch in a clean very well kept combination unit it speaks volumes without saying a word.

Replied on Fri, Feb 07, 2020 at 07:33 AM CST
Originally Posted by: KYLE VOGEL
Quote: "I see a lot wrong with these opinions on low rates mainly because I'm young and new to the business but I will say my truck and wagon doesn't move without profiting truth is some of these high dollar rigs are taking freight cheap not for profit but for cash flow and when you roll in for a load in late model rig with nice equipment your showing you're customer your making money when in reality your working for free to have top of the line truck and trailer my opinion is "it ain't the chrome that gets you home" if it's your family and home life that matters then make it your first priority I've got less invested in my intire rig then some peoples full coverage insurance for a year but it's been all over east coast and keeps on keepin on"

And you don't know who's swimming "naked" until the "tide" goes out.

Replied on Fri, Feb 07, 2020 at 08:33 AM CST
What some folks don’t understand is those guys didn’t just get those trucks nice trucks over night, they worked their way up to them, case in point my last truck was a 97 Pete, I paid 40k for it and ten years later got 25k for it when I traded it on a 07, if it had been a Volvo or freight shaker it would have only been worth 5k, those trucks don’t hold value, so your always having to come up with cash out of pocket for a down payment on your next ride. A 359 Pete from the 80’s will still bring 50k if it’s been taken care of, can anyone say the same about any other brand? It’s like a savings account.
Replied on Fri, Feb 07, 2020 at 11:19 AM CST
Originally Posted by: KYLE VOGEL
Quote: "I see a lot wrong with these opinions on low rates mainly because I'm young and new to the business but I will say my truck and wagon doesn't move without profiting truth is some of these high dollar rigs are taking freight cheap not for profit but for cash flow and when you roll in for a load in late model rig with nice equipment your showing you're customer your making money when in reality your working for free to have top of the line truck and trailer my opinion is "it ain't the chrome that gets you home" if it's your family and home life that matters then make it your first priority I've got less invested in my intire rig then some peoples full coverage insurance for a year but it's been all over east coast and keeps on keepin on"

Not trying to pick a fight with you, but the logic you laid out is that if we showed up in a 30 year old truck that was falling apart, with paint that didn’t match and duct tape holding the body panels together, somehow the shipper would pay us more? Why hasn’t that worked for the Somali’s then?
Replied on Fri, Feb 07, 2020 at 03:18 PM CST
+ 1

Not posting to offend anyone at all simply stating that if i land a load for half the price you would do the work for take in all the variables because my cost may be half what yours is simply because of difference in bottom line, however i do take offense to those thinking I’m rolling a role of duct tape down the interstate just because my truck and wagon has age doesn’t mean its mismatched and or is unsafe to operate, and also i like my customers to see myself as an asset not my equipment because without a decent operator all your rig can be considered is a hunk of steel

Replied on Fri, Feb 07, 2020 at 04:19 PM CST
Originally Posted by: KYLE VOGEL
Quote: "Not posting to offend anyone at all simply stating that if i land a load for half the price you would do the work for take in all the variables because my cost may be half what yours is simply because of difference in bottom line, however i do take offense to those thinking I’m rolling a role of duct tape down the interstate just because my truck and wagon has age doesn’t mean its mismatched and or is unsafe to operate, and also i like my customers to see myself as an asset not my equipment because without a decent operator all your rig can be considered is a hunk of steel "

You're not offending me that's for sure. I'm just pointing out that nice equipment actually makes a carrier money and increases potential to make even more money. Sure a ragged truck and trailer with a good driver will do great, no doubt. Brokers love combinations like that. They can depend on them, take a larger bite from the rate AND their customers could care less about who's moving their products or what their equipment looks like. However, I assure you good contract freight will demand a professional appearance and that includes the truck, trailer and the drivers attire/behavior.

So what you currently grossing and on how many miles?

Replied on Sat, Feb 08, 2020 at 04:49 PM CST
At least fuel is cheap up there in the North West. It would be different if you had high fuel tax , tolls, heavy traffic, and bad weather.
Replied on Sat, Feb 08, 2020 at 04:49 PM CST
+ 1
Originally Posted by: KYLE VOGEL
Quote: "Not posting to offend anyone at all simply stating that if i land a load for half the price you would do the work for take in all the variables because my cost may be half what yours is simply because of difference in bottom line, however i do take offense to those thinking I’m rolling a role of duct tape down the interstate just because my truck and wagon has age doesn’t mean its mismatched and or is unsafe to operate, and also i like my customers to see myself as an asset not my equipment because without a decent operator all your rig can be considered is a hunk of steel "

You're not running at half the cost of anybody no matter what you're driving. I have 97 KW and a 2017 Timpte, it's all paid for and I figure my cost to run is 1.40 a mile, that's all miles without paying myself. 2 bucks all miles at the end of the week would put me at the same pay as a company driver, that means rates have to be at least 2.50 a loaded mile, how many loads do you see even close to that in a week?

Replied on Sat, Feb 08, 2020 at 04:49 PM CST
Originally Posted by: KYLE VOGEL
Quote: "Not posting to offend anyone at all simply stating that if i land a load for half the price you would do the work for take in all the variables because my cost may be half what yours is simply because of difference in bottom line, however i do take offense to those thinking I’m rolling a role of duct tape down the interstate just because my truck and wagon has age doesn’t mean its mismatched and or is unsafe to operate, and also i like my customers to see myself as an asset not my equipment because without a decent operator all your rig can be considered is a hunk of steel "

For me, the difference between driving my old 87 international, and my current 379 is 7 cents per mile with the larger payment. I think my maintenance is similar because the 87 international was like new, but my point is, you cant haul cheaper just because your truck is cheap. Other people's money isn't my business but depending on miles , the spread for cost to operate between the most expensive rig, and cheapest rig is probably less than you think, because old stuff might have more maintenance. But either way, a sharp truck is a culture thing. It shows pride. Class pays
Replied on Sat, Feb 08, 2020 at 04:49 PM CST

I ask the broker for his 501c3 number so I can write off the difference required to make a good living

so far I haven’t gotten a number

Replied on Sat, Feb 08, 2020 at 04:50 PM CST
I am not offended, I am amused at the message that the truckers are the problem and not the rates, at a time when so many carriers of all sizes are going under, including the ones that are run by accountants and publicity traded on Wall Street.
Replied on Sun, Feb 09, 2020 at 06:38 AM CST
Originally Posted by: KYLE VOGEL
Quote: "Not posting to offend anyone at all simply stating that if i land a load for half the price you would do the work for take in all the variables because my cost may be half what yours is simply because of difference in bottom line, however i do take offense to those thinking I’m rolling a role of duct tape down the interstate just because my truck and wagon has age doesn’t mean its mismatched and or is unsafe to operate, and also i like my customers to see myself as an asset not my equipment because without a decent operator all your rig can be considered is a hunk of steel "

I have never seen your truck, so the duct tape comment wasn’t aimed at you, but if your logic is that the shipper thinks the rate is to high because you have a nice looking truck, then the duct tape special would be the opposite of that. I know a couple of people that run older trucks, and they still look like new, most shippers wouldn’t know they are 20 years old, but it costed them more to rebuild them than what they could of bought a newer one for, 30k for a engine rebuild, 7k for a reman tranny, 6k for both differentials, 20k for a new paint job, and months of down time to do all the work, plus the initial cost of the truck itself, what you wind up with is no depreciation sky high maintenance costs, lots of down time and a truck that has no loan value on paper, and a insurance problem if something goes wrong. Yes it can be done, but it’s a very expensive way to get there, and you definitely won’t get their by working for half as much as everyone else. There is a reason every fleet operation buys new, and trades every few years.
Replied on Sun, Feb 09, 2020 at 06:38 AM CST
+ 1
If your financial calculations don't assume payments for new or newer equipment or your cost of replacement, your an idiot. Your fuel calculations should be for the more expensive fuel in your travels. Anything less and your just digging a hole you aren't going to overcome.

Art Pfluger
Replied on Sun, Feb 09, 2020 at 06:38 AM CST

Just getting back in I'll tell you most the work I've done has been averaging 2-3 dollars a mile which I'll be the first to say I'd like to see it higher but hey it's not even a living I would say but it's a start and guys don't think that the rate that's posted is what it has to go for try to negotiate maybe not even on the rate but just the time it takes them to pay nothing against factoring but it is a cost at the end of the day I do think times will get better for myself and fellow truckers hang in there guys we are in this together!