Home > Forum > Why Don'T Brokers List The ACTUAL Product?

Why don't brokers list the ACTUAL product?

Jun 04, 2021 at 07:42 AM CST
+ 24
That's it that's the entire post. STOP PUTTING INDUSTRIAL or AGGREGATE! It's waste our time calling just to find out it's something we can't move. For those that don't know there are several types of pneumatics. With SPECIFIC abilities. It's bad enough you all won't post the rate but not posting the product is a complete waste of our time. With no legitimate reason.
Replied on Fri, Jun 04, 2021 at 01:45 PM CST
+ 1

Brokers don't want everyone who has access to the load board to INSTANTLY be able to determine who their customer is and back solicit

Replied on Fri, Jun 04, 2021 at 06:55 PM CST
+ 3
Quote: "Brokers don't want everyone who has access to the load board to INSTANTLY be able to determine who their customer is and back solicit"

If I say that I have a load of cement in Houston going to BFE, that doesn't help anyone know anything that they wouldn't find out on a phone call. WHICH WASTE BOTH PARTY'S TIME! I run a pneumatic. So it's extremely important to know what the product is. For instance plastic pellets require a certain kind of pneumatic and sand requires something totally different. Then there's powders like lime. Which yet again requires a different pneumatic and so on. It's annoying and a waste of time.
Replied on Sun, Jun 06, 2021 at 10:40 AM CST

A lot of them don't even get that far with customers they are just fishing for the most part to see if they can get interest in hauling before they get that far into it .

Replied on Sun, Jun 06, 2021 at 10:40 AM CST
Quote: "Brokers don't want everyone who has access to the load board to INSTANTLY be able to determine who their customer is and back solicit"

I'm asking sincerely to explain how this works. If someone's plan to keep a customer, is to keep them hidden from the competition, are they actually providing a service of any value? I have the same issue with posting the name of a totally different pickup or delivery location, just to keep their own customer hidden. If I can't keep a customer from dumping me the instant another random human calls them, am I really doing them any good in the first place? I know transportation is cut throat and I'm not trying to criticize, I'm hoping someone explains this to me without taking offense to it.
Replied on Mon, Jun 07, 2021 at 11:36 AM CST
Quote: "I'm asking sincerely to explain how this works. If someone's plan to keep a customer, is to keep them hidden from the competition, are they actually providing a service of any value? I have the same issue with posting the name of a totally different pickup or delivery location, just to keep their own customer hidden. If I can't keep a customer from dumping me the instant another random human calls them, am I really doing them any good in the first place? I know transportation is cut throat and I'm not trying to criticize, I'm hoping someone explains this to me without taking offense to it."

It's just a to not make it so easy to back solicit. At the end of the day back soliciting happens ALL THE TIME. NOTHING is going to protect someone from that. Among 3rd party sellers it is common practice to ship blind. The customer knows it's a blind shipment by looking at the paperwork most of the time and they are good with it. Why would you willingly give up the shippers info as a thrid party seller and kill your deal?

Replied on Mon, Jun 07, 2021 at 11:36 AM CST
Sometimes the actual pickup location is not even the location listed on the site, I called on a load that was listed as two different cities in two different states.
Replied on Wed, Jun 09, 2021 at 03:29 PM CST
+ 1

Is it back soliciting when there brokering another brokers load you see it all the time on b/l

Replied on Thu, Jun 10, 2021 at 07:08 AM CST
Quote: "It's just a to not make it so easy to back solicit. At the end of the day back soliciting happens ALL THE TIME. NOTHING is going to protect someone from that. Among 3rd party sellers it is common practice to ship blind. The customer knows it's a blind shipment by looking at the paperwork most of the time and they are good with it. Why would you willingly give up the shippers info as a thrid party seller and kill your deal? "

Doest that kinda mean that the deal you are trying to not kill, is super duper fragile , if your customer is willing to drop you that easily based on a cold contact from someone they've never heard of before?? But I do see your point, it just seems like that logic is trying to hold your customer hostage by hiding them from competition, when in my thinking, your service is what should keep them, right?
Replied on Thu, Jun 10, 2021 at 04:11 PM CST
Quote: "If I say that I have a load of cement in Houston going to BFE, that doesn't help anyone know anything that they wouldn't find out on a phone call. WHICH WASTE BOTH PARTY'S TIME! I run a pneumatic. So it's extremely important to know what the product is. For instance plastic pellets require a certain kind of pneumatic and sand requires something totally different. Then there's powders like lime. Which yet again requires a different pneumatic and so on. It's annoying and a waste of time."

I have a load out of La Porte TX going to Park City KY... Pneumatic that Needs to blow off

Product is MagOX

Call me if you have a truck available Monday the 14th

402.533.2018

I also have a weekly load that goes to Sulphur Springs TX weekly. same product and shipper.

Replied on Thu, Jun 10, 2021 at 04:11 PM CST
Quote: "Doest that kinda mean that the deal you are trying to not kill, is super duper fragile , if your customer is willing to drop you that easily based on a cold contact from someone they've never heard of before?? But I do see your point, it just seems like that logic is trying to hold your customer hostage by hiding them from competition, when in my thinking, your service is what should keep them, right?"

Is the competion friend or foe? If you don't know, then mums the word.

Replied on Fri, Jun 11, 2021 at 09:55 AM CST
+ 1
Quote: "I'm asking sincerely to explain how this works. If someone's plan to keep a customer, is to keep them hidden from the competition, are they actually providing a service of any value? I have the same issue with posting the name of a totally different pickup or delivery location, just to keep their own customer hidden. If I can't keep a customer from dumping me the instant another random human calls them, am I really doing them any good in the first place? I know transportation is cut throat and I'm not trying to criticize, I'm hoping someone explains this to me without taking offense to it."

Dale, I can't speak for anyone else, but I can tell you we have had a few O/O's call our customers behind our backs and offer to do the load for LESS that we were paying them initially, this takes "Broker hating" to an all new level, We're in the midst of a generation where loyalty means VERY little anymore. The majority of customers are looking for the cheapest way to move their freight, this makes sense. However, in a good number of the aformentioned cases the shipper ends up calling us back because either the trucking company couldn't get it done or couldn't handle the volume or whatever the reason might be. I'm also being sincere when I ask you this, could I have the contact information of your best paying customers so I can offer great service cheaper? Obviously I would NEVER do this but it should work the same both ways. I would never try to diminish what you guys do on a daily basis, I've been on that side of the wheel and we still run trucks here too. I still maintain as I mentioned in previous posts (And was degraded & ridiculed for) that the position of "Broker" does not have to be seen as evil, I know nobody will agree but we work for YOU, I'll spend countless hours/days working with customers to get rates up to where they're fair for EVERYONE. Then many times after all that another "Broker hater" will call them and make empty promises or tell them the rate needs to be higher or whatever. I've been told multiple times this is why many customers prefer to sue brokers, one call gets the load/loads covered as they rarely have time to field dozens of calls from others. I would assume like most if your wheels aint turnin' you aint earnin', you guys have a job to do and I cant imagine spending hours calling & emailing prospective shippers is very high on your "Love doing" list, correct me if I'm wrong but those hours aren't paying you anything. I also hear from many of you how you will bounce 300-400 miles right past a load paying $2.50/mi for a 400 mile load to get to a 500 mile load paying $3.50/mi, dont the bounce miles cost you about the same to drive? now i DO understand having to make a statement about nobody should be hauling cheap freight, "dont haul it & the rates will come up" Though I agree this would be GREAT!!, however the realist in me forces me to look back at recent history, this hasn't worked. There will ALWAYS be trucks out there willing to haul for barely over the price of fuel, though I do not agree with this practice I can understand why they do it. I k now I will be degraded and called names after this post as usual but I will always maintain there IS room for all of us to work in a symbiotic relationship. OK, let the derrogatory remarks begin.

Replied on Fri, Jun 11, 2021 at 10:46 AM CST

Mr. Kelly, when you list a load there is no spot for listing specific products, we are given a drop down menu with a small sampling of products.

Replied on Fri, Jun 11, 2021 at 01:27 PM CST
It's always humbling to hear the calm detailed explanations from you experienced people. It's a perspective I don't see personally .I appreciate it.
Replied on Fri, Jun 11, 2021 at 08:53 PM CST
Quote: "Mr. Kelly, when you list a load there is no spot for listing specific products, we are given a drop down menu with a small sampling of products. "

Well that needs to be fixed by the controllers of the app. They have multiple categories for hoppers. They need at minimum 2 categories for pneumatics. Because like I stated above knowing what the product is saves both party's time. Pneumatic trailers and the products they are designed to move are similarly varied as open deck trailers.
Replied on Fri, Jun 11, 2021 at 08:53 PM CST
Quote: "Dale, I can't speak for anyone else, but I can tell you we have had a few O/O's call our customers behind our backs and offer to do the load for LESS that we were paying them initially, this takes "Broker hating" to an all new level, We're in the midst of a generation where loyalty means VERY little anymore. The majority of customers are looking for the cheapest way to move their freight, this makes sense. However, in a good number of the aformentioned cases the shipper ends up calling us back because either the trucking company couldn't get it done or couldn't handle the volume or whatever the reason might be. I'm also being sincere when I ask you this, could I have the contact information of your best paying customers so I can offer great service cheaper? Obviously I would NEVER do this but it should work the same both ways. I would never try to diminish what you guys do on a daily basis, I've been on that side of the wheel and we still run trucks here too. I still maintain as I mentioned in previous posts (And was degraded & ridiculed for) that the position of "Broker" does not have to be seen as evil, I know nobody will agree but we work for YOU, I'll spend countless hours/days working with customers to get rates up to where they're fair for EVERYONE. Then many times after all that another "Broker hater" will call them and make empty promises or tell them the rate needs to be higher or whatever. I've been told multiple times this is why many customers prefer to sue brokers, one call gets the load/loads covered as they rarely have time to field dozens of calls from others. I would assume like most if your wheels aint turnin' you aint earnin', you guys have a job to do and I cant imagine spending hours calling & emailing prospective shippers is very high on your "Love doing" list, correct me if I'm wrong but those hours aren't paying you anything. I also hear from many of you how you will bounce 300-400 miles right past a load paying $2.50/mi for a 400 mile load to get to a 500 mile load paying $3.50/mi, dont the bounce miles cost you about the same to drive? now i DO understand having to make a statement about nobody should be hauling cheap freight, "dont haul it & the rates will come up" Though I agree this would be GREAT!!, however the realist in me forces me to look back at recent history, this hasn't worked. There will ALWAYS be trucks out there willing to haul for barely over the price of fuel, though I do not agree with this practice I can understand why they do it. I k now I will be degraded and called names after this post as usual but I will always maintain there IS room for all of us to work in a symbiotic relationship. OK, let the derrogatory remarks begin."

The thing that you brokers don't get is the expense involved with moving bulk freight. ESPECIALLY for someone like myself that runs a pneumatic. A bargain basement no frills new pneumatic cost about 50k to start and goes out to about 200k for a new vaccum pneumatic. Mine was 78k new. Then you have to buy a blower (12k) Quality hoses 1500 (have to be replaced yearly if you're lucky) Gaskets and miscellaneous parts just in case you get a leak while unloading 1k. All of this stuff has to constantly be replaced. Because blowing abrasive materials through anything ears eats through it. Including metal parts like T's have to be replaced. Then there's all the extra fuel. Because you have to run the truck wide open to unload the freight. Then FRs, respirators, ear plugs, steel toes, whipchecks, velcro straps, elbows and on and on and on. Notice I didn't list the truck. That was deliberate. That's why we drive past cheap freight. Anyone that books it or hauls it should go out of business. Fingers crossed. I actually spoke to a broker this week that said she didn't know what a pneumatic was. Her exact words and that they had never had one before. So I asked the product and rate. She said 700 dollars. I paused for a second because I wanted to say something spicy and decided to say ok thanks and hung up. 700 dollars for a 300 mile pneumatic load?! Btw what's your bargain basement start up cost? A cellphone, a laptop, and a desk? That's the difference. I'm well into the 200s.
Replied on Sat, Jun 12, 2021 at 07:12 AM CST
Quote: "Dale, I can't speak for anyone else, but I can tell you we have had a few O/O's call our customers behind our backs and offer to do the load for LESS that we were paying them initially, this takes "Broker hating" to an all new level, We're in the midst of a generation where loyalty means VERY little anymore. The majority of customers are looking for the cheapest way to move their freight, this makes sense. However, in a good number of the aformentioned cases the shipper ends up calling us back because either the trucking company couldn't get it done or couldn't handle the volume or whatever the reason might be. I'm also being sincere when I ask you this, could I have the contact information of your best paying customers so I can offer great service cheaper? Obviously I would NEVER do this but it should work the same both ways. I would never try to diminish what you guys do on a daily basis, I've been on that side of the wheel and we still run trucks here too. I still maintain as I mentioned in previous posts (And was degraded & ridiculed for) that the position of "Broker" does not have to be seen as evil, I know nobody will agree but we work for YOU, I'll spend countless hours/days working with customers to get rates up to where they're fair for EVERYONE. Then many times after all that another "Broker hater" will call them and make empty promises or tell them the rate needs to be higher or whatever. I've been told multiple times this is why many customers prefer to sue brokers, one call gets the load/loads covered as they rarely have time to field dozens of calls from others. I would assume like most if your wheels aint turnin' you aint earnin', you guys have a job to do and I cant imagine spending hours calling & emailing prospective shippers is very high on your "Love doing" list, correct me if I'm wrong but those hours aren't paying you anything. I also hear from many of you how you will bounce 300-400 miles right past a load paying $2.50/mi for a 400 mile load to get to a 500 mile load paying $3.50/mi, dont the bounce miles cost you about the same to drive? now i DO understand having to make a statement about nobody should be hauling cheap freight, "dont haul it & the rates will come up" Though I agree this would be GREAT!!, however the realist in me forces me to look back at recent history, this hasn't worked. There will ALWAYS be trucks out there willing to haul for barely over the price of fuel, though I do not agree with this practice I can understand why they do it. I k now I will be degraded and called names after this post as usual but I will always maintain there IS room for all of us to work in a symbiotic relationship. OK, let the derrogatory remarks begin."

Jim, your explanation gives a logical reason to be hush hush about the customer. I can understand your perspective on that. I don't understand the reason to hide the product or lie about the origin or destination. I can understand how it can give away a customer if someone follows the bread crumbs, but the consequences of hiding the product and town have an actual financial impact on the truck. In that case the truck is being used as the fulcrum point to leverage your tactic to maintain a customer. I think there's a reasonable margin, meaning if you offer a load out of milbank, you can have a 20 mile radius that's a milbank address. But I have seen loads posted saying milbank, but it loads in Watertown and that doesn't become clear until the rate confirmation is sent. Who pays for that 50 mile difference? And keeping the product quiet has consequences too, I have no intention of putting abrasive material in my hopper, or DDG in the summer. Again, I'm thinking out loud on this situation, not criticizing.
Replied on Sun, Jun 13, 2021 at 01:10 PM CST
Quote: "Jim, your explanation gives a logical reason to be hush hush about the customer. I can understand your perspective on that. I don't understand the reason to hide the product or lie about the origin or destination. I can understand how it can give away a customer if someone follows the bread crumbs, but the consequences of hiding the product and town have an actual financial impact on the truck. In that case the truck is being used as the fulcrum point to leverage your tactic to maintain a customer. I think there's a reasonable margin, meaning if you offer a load out of milbank, you can have a 20 mile radius that's a milbank address. But I have seen loads posted saying milbank, but it loads in Watertown and that doesn't become clear until the rate confirmation is sent. Who pays for that 50 mile difference? And keeping the product quiet has consequences too, I have no intention of putting abrasive material in my hopper, or DDG in the summer. Again, I'm thinking out loud on this situation, not criticizing."

I asked a broker in the van business years ago about the origin / destination thing. Their explaination was logical to me. And their intent wasn't to hide anything but to draw in more potential trucks with a larger radius search or a larger recognizable location. Have you ever widened you scope in search of something? They're doing the same thing in reverse. Hell you may come on to something that is closer than you expected.

I'm very careful about what I put in my trailer. For my sake and the shipper or recievers sake, (whether they are willing to put their product on my trailer). This means full discloser (about the equipment) and asking questions in order to not waste anyones time.