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Electronic Log Book and cost

Jan 17, 2016 at 11:05 AM CST
+ 1
I really want to know if anyone can explain to me why we (truckers) have to keep spending more money to keep up these laws and our freight is still between $1.45 to $1.65? The big corporation are trying to control the game but they can't keep good drivers either? I read that the electronic logbook will save 26 lives? That's not even 10 percent and why do independent truckers have to get electronic logs? Look at the percent of independent accidents and big corporation accidents! Who do the big boys and brokers call on when they need the job done? INDEPENDENT TRUCKERS!! This E-Log is only going to raise food and supply cost so the freight for having to stay away from home an extra day or 2 should increase!!! I tired of being ROBBED!!!!
Replied on Sun, Jan 17, 2016 at 11:40 AM CST
All I see we'll get from lectric logs is even more traffic congestion and trucks jockeying for parking spots to take breaks.
Replied on Sun, Jan 17, 2016 at 03:41 PM CST
That too bwahaha
Replied on Mon, Jan 18, 2016 at 09:00 AM CST
Same reason we are forced to pay $ 150.000 for trucks that spend more time in the shop then on the road. Some lawmaker must have a brother that works in the E- Log industry. DEF trucks are killing us. EZ Pass is tracking us.
Big brother want to put the O/O out of business.
Replied on Mon, Jan 18, 2016 at 09:59 PM CST
I feel this a ploy by the makers and the ATA. ATA has felt for years that us small outfits had an unfair advantage with things such as HOS. This is there solution to try to rid the Industry of the small companies. My son attended a seminar a few years ago and everyone was very blunt ATA and the government want the Industry down to 6-12 players, no more. At that point it will be easier for them to control it all.

Art Pfluger
Replied on Mon, Jan 18, 2016 at 10:11 PM CST
You could be right. A few years back I attended a get together of small carriers which was hosted by our insurance company.

Their main spokesman was with a large brokerage firm who we pulled a good amount of very good paying loads. His topic was supposed to be safety.

As the speaker was introducing himself he said he and his company were ATA members and fully support of the safety issues supported by the ATA.

I've never pulled another load for them. I've never seen a benefit from ATA.
Replied on Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 04:41 PM CST
Originally Posted by: RICHARD RICKLEY
Quote: "Same reason we are forced to pay $ 150.000 for trucks that spend more time in the shop then on the road. Some lawmaker must have a brother that works in the E- Log industry. DEF trucks are killing us. EZ Pass is tracking us. Big brother want to put the O/O out of business."

Exactly the government wants fewer small business all together. It is a lot easier to regulate a few companies compared to several thousand. It boils down plain and simply to control. This is why they want to trash the second amendment. Some of you may get upset but I will say it any way.
This is why the government turns a blind eye and resists GMO labeling and Monsanto and the whole GMO mess. You want to control the populace control the food.
Replied on Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 10:14 PM CST
A friend is a KW salesman. He went to a meeting that a speaker from EPA. The speaker started by stating that they can do as they wish in our industry because we are a fractured bunch of idiots. I think ATA and the government feel the same. Every ATA member I've spoke with tow the ATA Bullshit.

Art Pfluger
Replied on Wed, Jan 20, 2016 at 08:26 AM CST
+ 1
The big companies are the problem . They got the most unsafe and unqualified drivers out here . Heck ya the want e-log the majority of the drivers can't even read less headache for them than paper logs
Replied on Wed, Jan 20, 2016 at 08:26 AM CST
+ 2
The big companies are the problem . They got the most unsafe and unqualified drivers out here . Heck ya the want e-log the majority of the drivers can't even read less headache for them than paper logs
Replied on Wed, Jan 20, 2016 at 10:43 AM CST
Yeah I'm already considering getting rid of the 2005 model I just bought and finding a pre-2000? But I wonder how long that loopholes will be open?
Replied on Wed, Jan 20, 2016 at 12:55 PM CST
Originally Posted by: DUSTIN MASSINGILL
Quote: "Yeah I'm already considering getting rid of the 2005 model I just bought and finding a pre-2000? But I wonder how long that loopholes will be open?"

Im trying to read enough of the garbage to find out about the speed limiters. So far I don't see an attachment exemption for older model trucks http://www.overdriveonline.com/bevy-of-rulemaking-activity-expected-soon-including-speed-limiter-mandate-apnea-pre-rule-and-cdl-clearinghouse/
Replied on Wed, Jan 20, 2016 at 12:56 PM CST
Originally Posted by: DUSTIN MASSINGILL
Quote: "Yeah I'm already considering getting rid of the 2005 model I just bought and finding a pre-2000? But I wonder how long that loopholes will be open?"

Im trying to read enough of the garbage to find out about the speed limiters. So far I don't see an attachment exemption for older model trucks http://www.overdriveonline.com/bevy-of-rulemaking-activity-expected-soon-including-speed-limiter-mandate-apnea-pre-rule-and-cdl-clearinghouse/
Replied on Wed, Jan 20, 2016 at 03:45 PM CST
I just got off the phone with our lawyer. He seems to think ELD is our least worry. He's looking over 267 pages of new FMCSA rules. He says some of the new rules come into effect beginning next month and FMCSA estimates they will shut down 25 trucking companies per month.

Sounds like we're playing against a stacked deck to me.
Replied on Wed, Jan 20, 2016 at 06:21 PM CST
+ 1
Elogs will put most of out of the grain hauling business.
How many times have you run out of hours while sitting in line waiting to load or unload?

Replied on Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 02:15 AM CST
+ 1
William it will be extremely tough at first, we are already starting to save sum money for a slow start until we can figure this out, the shippers and receivers will either have to pay us to sit , or they won't get any product from no one. It's gonna be ungodly tough till u can find a groove, no more OTR trucking
Replied on Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 07:50 AM CST
It will be a total nightmare. I sometimes haul into places during harvest that have 4hr line ups or worse. Example: Cargill in Sioux City. When you go there you get in line and you never know how long the line is going to be so you will stay in line until you run out of time and once you run out of time there you will sit making everyone go around you. Sometimes there isn't gonna be room to get around them very easily of at all so hopefully somebody can get something to exempt agriculture from the mandate before it takes effect or something. There is or was a law in the rule book, I can't remember which article it is but when I got audited the officer thought he had found a problem on my logbook. I thought we had messed up and got caught. We had hauled a load of beans from the farm to Sioux city in the morning and then only took 6hrs off before we had to do a night run on hauling cattle. He asked what was going on and I said the driver must have messed up his math and we got the tickets out and it had been a load off of our farm to the elevator. He said we were ok then. I was confused and asked him how it was fine so he pulled out the rule book and showed me. There is an article in there that says if a truck is hauling directly off of a farm to where it is benefiting the farmer then that truck is allowed to run 24hrs a day with no restrictions as long as it is not between December 15- February 15. I can see if I still have what article it is and if it is still there or if the have removed it. I had no idea such a law was there and this was country wide not just for Nebraska. Does anybody else know of this law? He said only reason he knew about it is because he wrote a guy a violation on his logbook and his lawyer found this law and they dropped the violation.
Replied on Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 08:26 AM CST
+ 1
Originally Posted by: CLINT WEYHRICH
Quote: "It will be a total nightmare. I sometimes haul into places during harvest that have 4hr line ups or worse. Example: Cargill in Sioux City. When you go there you get in line and you never know how long the line is going to be so you will stay in line until you run out of time and once you run out of time there you will sit making everyone go around you. Sometimes there isn't gonna be room to get around them very easily of at all so hopefully somebody can get something to exempt agriculture from the mandate before it takes effect or something. There is or was a law in the rule book, I can't remember which article it is but when I got audited the officer thought he had found a problem on my logbook. I thought we had messed up and got caught. We had hauled a load of beans from the farm to Sioux city in the morning and then only took 6hrs off before we had to do a night run on hauling cattle. He asked what was going on and I said the driver must have messed up his math and we got the tickets out and it had been a load off of our farm to the elevator. He said we were ok then. I was confused and asked him how it was fine so he pulled out the rule book and showed me. There is an article in there that says if a truck is hauling directly off of a farm to where it is benefiting the farmer then that truck is allowed to run 24hrs a day with no restrictions as long as it is not between December 15- February 15. I can see if I still have what article it is and if it is still there or if the have removed it. I had no idea such a law was there and this was country wide not just for Nebraska. Does anybody else know of this law? He said only reason he knew about it is because he wrote a guy a violation on his logbook and his lawyer found this law and they dropped the violation. "

Clint, we were told the same thing. Ours also added that if we were hauling feed to livestock the same 24 hr/7 days a week rule applied there as well. But he did say that if we were stopped by an officer in the field he may have different thoughts to the rule. Also you had to be under the 150 mile air radius from the elevator or livestock you are hauling to.
Replied on Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 09:20 AM CST
Originally Posted by: TODD MAU
Quote: "Clint, we were told the same thing. Ours also added that if we were hauling feed to livestock the same 24 hr/7 days a week rule applied there as well. But he did say that if we were stopped by an officer in the field he may have different thoughts to the rule. Also you had to be under the 150 mile air radius from the elevator or livestock you are hauling to."

Yes I forgot to add the radius part. My question is how would that work in my apportioned trucks if I have to go to elogs because the program on those doesn't account for special situations like that.
Replied on Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 04:00 PM CST
+ 1
We run E-logs hauling Hazardous (Anhydrous Ammonia). Every state has what they call a Ag Exemption, we use it all the time . It is logged on what they call Line 5 on E-Logs (ON -DUTY DRIVING). 395.1-k is the number for ag exempt..Also the dates for ag-exempt varies from state to state. For instance Indiana is Jan 1 to Dec 1.
Replied on Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 04:05 PM CST
Originally Posted by: JOHN MYERS
Quote: "We run E-logs hauling Hazardous (Anhydrous Ammonia). Every state has what they call a Ag Exemption, we use it all the time . It is logged on what they call Line 5 on E-Logs (ON -DUTY DRIVING). 395.1-k is the number for ag exempt..Also the dates for ag-exempt varies from state to state. For instance Indiana is Jan 1 to Dec 1."

What kind of elogs do you run? I had vdo roadlog and it did not have that option. It only had the 4 lines. On duty, driving, off-duty, and sleeper berth.
Replied on Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 07:08 PM CST
Don't mean to beat a dead horse but I have heard so many different versions of the new rule. Tried callling DOT they can't even answer any questions. Most of the year I pull for the elevators in my home area. But we do haul quite a bit OTR. When running at home we are not required to run a log book. Anyone know how that is going to work with the new elog.
Replied on Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 07:19 PM CST
+ 1
Originally Posted by: JEFF FEDLER
Quote: "Don't mean to beat a dead horse but I have heard so many different versions of the new rule. Tried callling DOT they can't even answer any questions. Most of the year I pull for the elevators in my home area. But we do haul quite a bit OTR. When running at home we are not required to run a log book. Anyone know how that is going to work with the new elog."

Good question. I would like to know that too.
Replied on Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 07:25 PM CST
If you all are talking about the farm to market rule, that rule only applies to the farmer delivering his crops to the market or elevator as the case may be.
it is limited to 150 nautical miles and the truck had to be properly tagged for such deliveries.
thats what the auditor told me in August
Replied on Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 07:59 PM CST
My auditor from Nebraska told me it could be any driver from anywhere as long as he could prove he was only doing that one job. In his case in court where he didn't know about the rule when he pulled a guy over from Texas who was hauling for a guy in Nebraska. It says in the rule any driver, not the farmer or owner of the commodity.

(k) Agricultural operations. The provisions of this part shall not apply during planting and harvesting periods, as determined by each State, to drivers transporting

(1) Agricultural commodities from the source of the agricultural commodities to a location within a 150 air-mile radius from the source;

(2) Farm supplies for agricultural purposes from a wholesale or retail distribution point of the farm supplies to a farm or other location where the farm supplies are intended to be used within a 150 air-mile radius from the distribution point; or

(3) Farm supplies for agricultural purposes from a wholesale distribution point of the farm supplies to a retail distribution point of the farm supplies within a 150 air-mile radius from the wholesale distribution point.

(l) Ground water well drilling operations. In the instance of a driver of a commercial motor vehicle who is used primarily in the transportation and operations of a ground water well drilling rig, any period of 7 or 8 consecutive days may end with the beginning of any off-duty period of 24 or more successive hours.

(m) Construction materials and equipment . In the instance of a driver of a commercial motor vehicle who is used primarily in the transportation of construction materials and equipment, any period of 7 or 8 consecutive days may end with the beginning of any off-duty period of 24 or more successive hours.

(n) Utility service vehicles. The provisions of this part shall not apply to a driver of a utility service vehicle as defined in § 395.2.

(o) Property-carrying driver . A property-carrying driver is exempt from the requirements of § 395.3(a)(2) if:

(1) The driver has returned to the driver's normal work reporting location and the carrier released the driver from duty at that location for the previous five duty tours the driver has worked;

(2) The driver has returned to the normal work reporting location and the carrier releases the driver from duty within 16 hours after coming on duty following 10 consecutive hours off duty; and

(3) The driver has not taken this exemption within the previous 6 consecutive days, except when the driver has begun a new 7- or 8-consecutive day period with the beginning of any off-duty period of 34 or more consecutive hours as allowed by § 395.3(c).

(p) Commercial motor vehicle transportation to or from a motion picture production site . A driver of a commercial motor vehicle providing transportation of property or passengers to or from a theatrical or television motion picture production site is exempt from the requirements of § 395.3(a) if the driver operates within a 100 air-mile radius of the location where the driver reports to and is released from work, i.e., the normal work-reporting location. With respect to the maximum daily hours of service, such a driver may not drive—

(1) More than 10 hours following 8 consecutive hours off duty;

(2) For any period after having been on duty 15 hours following 8 consecutive hours off duty.

(3) If a driver of a commercial motor vehicle providing transportation of property or passengers to or from a theatrical or television motion picture production site operates beyond a 100 air-mile radius of the normal work-reporting location, the driver is subject to § 395.3(a), and paragraphs (p)(1) and (2) of this section do not apply.

(q) Attendance on commercial motor vehicles containing Division 1.1, 1.2, or 1.3 explosives. Operators who are required by 49 CFR 397.5 to be in attendance on commercial motor vehicles containing Division 1.1, 1.2, or 1.3 explosives are on duty at all times while performing attendance functions or any other work for a motor carrier. Operators of commercial motor vehicles containing Division 1.1, 1.2, or 1.3 explosives subject to the requirements for a 30-minute rest break in § 395.3(a)(3)(ii) may use 30 minutes or more of attendance time to meet the requirement for a rest break, providing they perform no other work during the break. Such drivers must record the rest break as on-duty time in their record of duty status with remarks or annotations to indicate the specific on-duty periods that are used to meet the requirement for break.

(r) Railroad signal employees. The provisions of this part shall not apply to a signal employee, as defined in § 395.2, who operates a commercial motor vehicle, is engaged in installing, repairing, or maintaining signal systems, is employed by a railroad carrier or a contractor or subcontractor to a railroad carrier, while regulated by the Federal Railroad Administration.

(s) Covered farm vehicles. The rules in this part do not apply to drivers of “covered farm vehicles,” as defined in 49 CFR 390.5.

Citation: [57 FR 33647, July 30, 1992, as amended at 58 FR 33777, June 21, 1993; 60 FR 38748, July 28, 1995; 61 FR 14679, Apr. 3, 1996; 63 FR 33279, June 18, 1998; 68 FR 22515, Apr. 28, 2003; 68 FR 56211, Sept. 30, 2003; 70 FR 50071, Aug. 25, 2005; 72 FR 36790, July 5, 2007; 72 FR 55703, Oct. 1, 2007; 72 FR 71269, Dec. 17, 2007; 76 FR 25590, May 5, 2011; 76 FR 81186, Dec. 27, 2011; 77 FR 7544, Feb. 23, 2012; 78 FR 16195, Mar. 14, 2013; 78 FR 58484, Sept. 24, 2013]

Disclaimer:

Although we make every effort to assure that the information we provide is complete and accurate, it is not intended to take the place of published agency regulations. Regulations issued by the U.S. Department of Transportation and its Operating Administrations are published in the Federal Register and compiled in the U.S. Code of Federal Regulations (CFR). Copies of appropriate volumes of the CFR in book format may be purchased from the Superintendent of Documents, U.S. Government Printing Office, or examined at many libraries.

The CFR may also be viewed online at http://ECFR.gpoaccess.gov.

Replied on Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 08:00 PM CST
Sorry copied more than I thought but that is copied straight from the fmsca rule book online
Replied on Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 11:02 PM CST
+ 1
Well maybe i can answer some questions on hauling local or off the farm. I called washington dc about month ago and i asked about local hauling from my home base. And got told was that if youjust run local within 100 mile radus you do not need elog. You can run paper logs or time card. And it will be treated the same as it is right now. And it does not matter how old the truck is eather. And i also got told that if you run 7 day in a month out of your home base and the rest of the time local for that month. You do not need a elog in your truck no mater what year it is. Thats what dot told me in washington. And i had to ask to about glider kits to. And if you get a glider with 2000 or older engine they cant do nothing about it. So thats what i was told from them so dont know if that helps you or not.
Replied on Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 08:49 AM CST
+ 1
We have Qualcom units. And yes you have to be within 150 air mile radius of the terminal you are haling out of,and within that states ag exemption dates.
Replied on Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 09:11 AM CST
Originally Posted by: JODY SHELLITO
Quote: "Well maybe i can answer some questions on hauling local or off the farm. I called washington dc about month ago and i asked about local hauling from my home base. And got told was that if youjust run local within 100 mile radus you do not need elog. You can run paper logs or time card. And it will be treated the same as it is right now. And it does not matter how old the truck is eather. And i also got told that if you run 7 day in a month out of your home base and the rest of the time local for that month. You do not need a elog in your truck no mater what year it is. Thats what dot told me in washington. And i had to ask to about glider kits to. And if you get a glider with 2000 or older engine they cant do nothing about it. So thats what i was told from them so dont know if that helps you or not. "

6 months out of the year I run dry van long distance where I have to run e-logs while the other 6 months I run hopper both local and long distance so I was wondering how I can do it with elogs while I am hauling off the farm for customers locally. May have to get a cheap county commercial truck for local stuff I guess and a second dot number.
Replied on Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 03:02 PM CST
While it's good to have the conversations, and there's some good info being exchanged, I haven't seen yet how we can continue going to places such as cargill and sitting in line to load pellets going 500 miles south. Sitting there 6-8 hours on average just to get loaded, I "run" out of hours every time I go there trying to get loaded.


go to mcalester and see how many hours you'll sit in line trying to unload corn you picked up in northern ks. The farm or ag rule will not apply in these cases.
i don't know anybody willing to sit in line waiting to unload, run out of hours and would pull out of line to take a 10 hour break, only to repeat that cycle.
Replied on Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 03:34 PM CST
Originally Posted by: WILLIAM JEWELL
Quote: "While it's good to have the conversations, and there's some good info being exchanged, I haven't seen yet how we can continue going to places such as cargill and sitting in line to load pellets going 500 miles south. Sitting there 6-8 hours on average just to get loaded, I "run" out of hours every time I go there trying to get loaded. go to mcalester and see how many hours you'll sit in line trying to unload corn you picked up in northern ks. The farm or ag rule will not apply in these cases. i don't know anybody willing to sit in line waiting to unload, run out of hours and would pull out of line to take a 10 hour break, only to repeat that cycle."

Exactly
Replied on Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 04:22 PM CST
+ 1
The way I understand is everyone in our group is going to either get paid to sit and wait or they will refuse to go to that particular place. If enough of us do this which we all think that we will have no choice but to charge them to sit whether were unloading or loading it would just become a norm. How much we are going to get paid is going to be the next question
Replied on Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 04:37 PM CST
- 1
I run teas only and all i see refered to is interstate nothing about intrastate, so i'm wondering if there will be intrastate exceptions. texas is kind of a different state anyways in that there are several ways to log or keep duty status , they have the federal 11/14 rule , the 12/8 rule i think a 10/14 rule as well as 100 , 150 air mile , oilfield , agriculture and drive away so ... i'm just wondering which they will decide to adopt or if they will be able to opt out of the fed for intrastate drivers........
Replied on Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 06:17 PM CST
Here is a perfect example of a suck factor that happened to me today. I went to St Louis from my home terminal three and a half hour drive I also came back three and a half hour drive I waited two hours in St Louis to load and it took me 1 hour to load at my destination I waited three hour to unload and it took me 1 hour to unload then, if I was on electronic log I would not have been able to unload because the place closes at 5 p.m. on Fridays. Therefore the shippers product would have been stuck on my truck all weekend long. I would not have been able to utilize my truck for other shipments. Questions that come to mind who is going to pay for the product to sit in my truck all weekend because the government would not allow me to work not because I was not tired but because I was sitting doing nothing who is going to pay for that time cuz this shit ain't free this is going to be a logistic nightmare.
Replied on Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 06:25 PM CST
I forgot to add my half hour break plus I would have had to have slept in my truck 31 miles from my home then when my break was over I woulda had to drive home on my time and my dime then Monday morning I would have had to drive back on my time and my dime this is not going to cut it guys we are in deep s***
Replied on Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 07:44 PM CST
Originally Posted by: JASON WEAST
Quote: "I forgot to add my half hour break plus I would have had to have slept in my truck 31 miles from my home then when my break was over I woulda had to drive home on my time and my dime then Monday morning I would have had to drive back on my time and my dime this is not going to cut it guys we are in deep s***"

That is why I went back to paper logs. Got tired of sleeping in the truck less than an hour from home. Wife didn't like it either.
Replied on Sat, Jan 23, 2016 at 08:59 AM CST
+ 1
https://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/hours-service/elds/electronic-logging-devices-and-hours-service-supporting-documents Go to page 8. It gives the exemptions. You guys wanting to know who or how you will get paid for wasted time, its simple. You have to charge whoever is paying the bill. You must include it in the rate. If you only haul 1 load per day because of how long it takes then that 1 load needs to be billed at a rate that pays the truck for the whole day. Also needs to have enough money on it to make it worth it to sleep in the truck 30 mi from home or to kill a weekend in the truck somewhere you dont want to be, or to miss loads because of delays. If I had to run elogs it would be set so the truck makes a minimum of 1200/day on shorter hauls that i know i would run out of hours on and $5/mi on ALL miles not loaded miles on longer runs to account for traffic, weather, delays at each end, spending weekends away from home and all the other bs that comes with it. I don't expect much work at those rates so i won't run e logs. For those of you that want to run them it's on you to make sure you get paid what you think you're worth, cant haul a $200 load of carn that takes all day to do
Replied on Sat, Jan 23, 2016 at 10:13 AM CST
thinking bout things , i guess i am kind of a different light possibly. I haul the same exact product from the same place to 3 different feed mills each week . I haul one load a day monday thru friday. In light of that i am and am not under obligation to my shipper other that 1 load a day. the rest of the time I am not under any type of dispatch. I own my truck , my name is on my truck , the title to the truck etc... so once my commercial obligation is filled every day then i am pretty sure i can go to line 5 personal conveyance as I am not engaging in any type of commercial commerce until i pull onto the scale at the shippers place of business. I own the vehicle i drive so therefore i can use it in any capacity i wish as long is it within the bounds of the law of the land and I am not using it for business prposes. inother words..its a commercial vehicle from the time i load until i unload and after that its just my motorhome. any thoughts ?
Replied on Sat, Jan 23, 2016 at 12:59 PM CST
YES YOU GOT THAT RIGHT THE BIG COMPANYS AND WE ALL KNOW WHO THEY ARE .I SEE THEM TEXTING ON THERE PHONE AND SOMETIME SC RACED TO PASS THEM CAUSE THERE ALL OVER THE ROAD . I HAVE HAD TO LAY ON MY HORN GOING BY THEM CAUSE THEY DRIFT IN MY LANE .
Replied on Sat, Jan 23, 2016 at 06:17 PM CST
You are right,but you cannot have a trailer hooked to it.
Replied on Sat, Jan 23, 2016 at 06:28 PM CST
thats a very gray area with comflicting consensus on having a trailer or not. under the fmcsa no where does it say you cannot have a trailer , also there is no real or actual law but only guidance.at least thats all i can find on the govt. as well as dot websites.
Replied on Sat, Jan 23, 2016 at 07:15 PM CST
Kevin, u are correct, but how about the DOT that gives you a ticket anyway, and you have to spend ridiculous amounts of money to prove nothing, until the next DOT decides his own interpretation of the law is better than yours. On and on ,again, you know.
Replied on Sat, Jan 23, 2016 at 10:50 PM CST
For what it is worth our DOT compliance guy is a 30 veteran DOT / DPS officer in Arizona. He says trailer makes no difference. I haven't had to fight this one yet