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Fuel

Oct 05, 2021 at 07:21 AM CST
+ 17
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

In ne n Dakota fuel hit 3.99 last week in Lewiston Mt fuel 3.89. 1/3 of the oil wells are shutdown in Nd. Propane in short supply at least that is what is being said
Replied on Tue, Oct 05, 2021 at 02:22 PM CST
- 1
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Yikes! Any particular reason why the wells are down?
Replied on Tue, Oct 05, 2021 at 02:35 PM CST
+ 2
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Yikes! Any particular reason why the wells are down?"

BIDEN
Replied on Tue, Oct 05, 2021 at 09:01 PM CST
+ 2
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "BIDEN"

I couldn't have said it better myself.
Replied on Wed, Oct 06, 2021 at 08:27 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

I was in Waterloo Iowa last week and there were 3 truck stops out of diesel fuel
Replied on Wed, Oct 06, 2021 at 08:59 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

Great falls limit you to 100 gallons 3.99 gallon
Replied on Wed, Oct 06, 2021 at 01:14 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "BIDEN"

Please explain.
Replied on Wed, Oct 06, 2021 at 01:25 PM CST
+ 1
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

fairly simple. where were fuel prices and oil prices were under trump. where are they now.
Replied on Wed, Oct 06, 2021 at 09:20 PM CST
- 1
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "fairly simple. where were fuel prices and oil prices were under trump. where are they now."

The numbers don't back up your assertion. Crude was trading at 26.68 in January 2016. It had doubled by December 2016 to 53.75. June 2020 it was trading in the 40 dollar range. We all know what was going on then. By December 2020 it was trading at 67 dollars. So it went from 26 dollars to 67 dollars under the previous administration. Even though demand was extremely low in 2020. It was trading in the 70s today. The oil industry is most likely trying to make up for 2020 losses.
Replied on Thu, Oct 07, 2021 at 07:19 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "The numbers don't back up your assertion. Crude was trading at 26.68 in January 2016. It had doubled by December 2016 to 53.75. June 2020 it was trading in the 40 dollar range. We all know what was going on then. By December 2020 it was trading at 67 dollars. So it went from 26 dollars to 67 dollars under the previous administration. Even though demand was extremely low in 2020. It was trading in the 70s today. The oil industry is most likely trying to make up for 2020 losses."

Wouldn't it affect the price of oil to shut down a pipe line that would have been efficiently pumping oil to the refineries? Seems to me that disrupts the supply chain of crude therefore causing the price to go up. Yes, liberals love to say that the pipeline wasn't pumping yet, but it would have been. Speculation is involved in every other aspect of our economy, why wouldn't it be in that case?
Replied on Thu, Oct 07, 2021 at 07:54 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

High fuel prices have always been good for my business.
Replied on Thu, Oct 07, 2021 at 07:54 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

Excellent research David. My question is where is the price of fuel today compared to the Trump years. I am not the biggest fan of Trump but i seem to remember that my fuel bill was not as far out of control back then as it started to be 6 weeks or so after Biden took office.
Replied on Thu, Oct 07, 2021 at 11:37 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Wouldn't it affect the price of oil to shut down a pipe line that would have been efficiently pumping oil to the refineries? Seems to me that disrupts the supply chain of crude therefore causing the price to go up. Yes, liberals love to say that the pipeline wasn't pumping yet, but it would have been. Speculation is involved in every other aspect of our economy, why wouldn't it be in that case?"

The price of oil doubled in the previous administration's 1st year. (Up 27 dollars) It tripled of the entire term. It's up 10 dollars in this one. This is most likely private business making up for their 2020 losses. Let's not forget that in 2020 at it's worst oil was trading at -50 dollars a barrel. Which meant they were paying people 50 dollars to take a barrel of oil.
Replied on Thu, Oct 07, 2021 at 11:38 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Excellent research David. My question is where is the price of fuel today compared to the Trump years. I am not the biggest fan of Trump but i seem to remember that my fuel bill was not as far out of control back then as it started to be 6 weeks or so after Biden took office."

You do know what happened in 2020 right? 2020 was literally a poop sandwich. Nothing should be compared to it. Oil companies were paying people to take oil off their hands. Because everyone was sitting at home getting fat. The vaccine landed in December 2020. People started getting vaccinated and you know, moving around. So it's natural for the price of a product to go up when the demand goes up. Especially after all the losses from last year. About 90% of my work is oilfield related. So I pay attention to the industry.
Replied on Thu, Oct 07, 2021 at 11:53 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Wouldn't it affect the price of oil to shut down a pipe line that would have been efficiently pumping oil to the refineries? Seems to me that disrupts the supply chain of crude therefore causing the price to go up. Yes, liberals love to say that the pipeline wasn't pumping yet, but it would have been. Speculation is involved in every other aspect of our economy, why wouldn't it be in that case?"

I forgot to address the pipeline. If you're talking about the one from Canada, it's a complete scam. I'll explain I know for a fact that there are oil refineries in WY and CO. Nevermind the 17 oil refineries IN CANADA! So why would a company pump oil thousands of miles and bypass several closer refineries? I'll answer. The crude comes from oil sands. That's why. It's dirty nasty oil. They want to pump it to Houston so it can be put on a ship and sent overseas. Because it can't be used over here for environmental reasons. Why doesn't Canada pump it to THEIR west coast and put it on a ship? Canadians care about their wilderness areas and blocked it. So the next best thing is to jeopardize the US. Because we're always for sale. Regardless of risk and consequences. The whole damn world knows this. That's why China is currently buying up US farmland like crazy. It's why the Saudis pumped all of their aquifers (underground lakes) dry grows hay for animals. But are now doing the same thing in AZ. Without any oversight or regulation. They dig the well and can take as much water as they like. The farms look like prisons with armed guards and everything. But by all means continue to worry about the important stuff, other people's money.
Replied on Thu, Oct 07, 2021 at 11:53 AM CST
+ 1
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

I also have some first hand knowlege of the oil industry. Probably not as much as you though. Yes 2020 was a shit sandwich. You mention vaccines. Remember how the Democrats were totally against them and pushed everyone to not take them. What is the Democratic parties stance on vaccines now? Two different topics I will agree. From my perspective I am not a fan of Big Government in any way shape or form, no matter who resides in the White House. Past history in my life shows that when the Democrats have power I get hosed. Remember Obama care..."we have to pass it to see what is in it... It appears that is happening again. Government overreach needs to be stopped and immediately, whether it is in oil and fuel price or in any other aspect of life. Your numbers and research are outstanding and your opinion is relatively sound. I just happen to disagree with you. So far in this country, we are still allowed to have a different opinion until the Government takes that away from us. My best regards to you David. Your arguments are valid, but as i said, I disagree with you.
Replied on Thu, Oct 07, 2021 at 12:47 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "I also have some first hand knowlege of the oil industry. Probably not as much as you though. Yes 2020 was a shit sandwich. You mention vaccines. Remember how the Democrats were totally against them and pushed everyone to not take them. What is the Democratic parties stance on vaccines now? Two different topics I will agree. From my perspective I am not a fan of Big Government in any way shape or form, no matter who resides in the White House. Past history in my life shows that when the Democrats have power I get hosed. Remember Obama care..."we have to pass it to see what is in it... It appears that is happening again. Government overreach needs to be stopped and immediately, whether it is in oil and fuel price or in any other aspect of life. Your numbers and research are outstanding and your opinion is relatively sound. I just happen to disagree with you. So far in this country, we are still allowed to have a different opinion until the Government takes that away from us. My best regards to you David. Your arguments are valid, but as i said, I disagree with you. "

I have no clue what you're talking about. However this isn't a political issue. It's private business selling their product for what the market can bare. That's literally capitalism.
Replied on Thu, Oct 07, 2021 at 12:53 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "I forgot to address the pipeline. If you're talking about the one from Canada, it's a complete scam. I'll explain I know for a fact that there are oil refineries in WY and CO. Nevermind the 17 oil refineries IN CANADA! So why would a company pump oil thousands of miles and bypass several closer refineries? I'll answer. The crude comes from oil sands. That's why. It's dirty nasty oil. They want to pump it to Houston so it can be put on a ship and sent overseas. Because it can't be used over here for environmental reasons. Why doesn't Canada pump it to THEIR west coast and put it on a ship? Canadians care about their wilderness areas and blocked it. So the next best thing is to jeopardize the US. Because we're always for sale. Regardless of risk and consequences. The whole damn world knows this. That's why China is currently buying up US farmland like crazy. It's why the Saudis pumped all of their aquifers (underground lakes) dry grows hay for animals. But are now doing the same thing in AZ. Without any oversight or regulation. They dig the well and can take as much water as they like. The farms look like prisons with armed guards and everything. But by all means continue to worry about the important stuff, other people's money."

David, I had question marks at the end of my sentences in my post. Not exclamation marks. I'm asking because the pipeline seemed relevant to me. Maybe it's not. I don't know, I'm not an expert and 2021 has made me sick of the word expert. and I'm not worried about other people's money, I have a hard enough time with my own. The only thing that matters to me is how other social humans interact with me in my life in a way that allows me to provide for my family, and unless I'm interpreting your post wrong, I know not to ask you questions in the future.
Replied on Thu, Oct 07, 2021 at 01:38 PM CST
+ 1
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Wouldn't it affect the price of oil to shut down a pipe line that would have been efficiently pumping oil to the refineries? Seems to me that disrupts the supply chain of crude therefore causing the price to go up. Yes, liberals love to say that the pipeline wasn't pumping yet, but it would have been. Speculation is involved in every other aspect of our economy, why wouldn't it be in that case?"

From my understanding (and I'm not a dumb ass democrat or a retarded republican) the pipeline that got shut down was to bring Canadian crude to the gulf coast for refining and be exported. Wasn't going to make a whole lot of difference in domestic price. Now, I didn't get that information from Fox or CNN but from a trans Canada employee trying to get the pipeline put in. (Probably not a credible source)
Replied on Thu, Oct 07, 2021 at 04:39 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "David, I had question marks at the end of my sentences in my post. Not exclamation marks. I'm asking because the pipeline seemed relevant to me. Maybe it's not. I don't know, I'm not an expert and 2021 has made me sick of the word expert. and I'm not worried about other people's money, I have a hard enough time with my own. The only thing that matters to me is how other social humans interact with me in my life in a way that allows me to provide for my family, and unless I'm interpreting your post wrong, I know not to ask you questions in the future."

I think I replied to the wrong person. That comment was meant for someone talking about vaccines
Replied on Thu, Oct 07, 2021 at 04:53 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "From my understanding (and I'm not a dumb ass democrat or a retarded republican) the pipeline that got shut down was to bring Canadian crude to the gulf coast for refining and be exported. Wasn't going to make a whole lot of difference in domestic price. Now, I didn't get that information from Fox or CNN but from a trans Canada employee trying to get the pipeline put in. (Probably not a credible source) "

You are 100% correct. I said it above. A pipeline to the west coast of Canada would be much shorter. But Canadians don't want to put their country in jeopardy. It's so odd to me that people are ok with a foreign company forcing Americans to put something on their land. Against their will. Nevermind the weirdness of truck drivers arguing in favor of a pipeline that puts truck drivers out of work. Hell every pipeline puts truck drivers out of work.
Replied on Fri, Oct 08, 2021 at 07:59 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

To the gentleman that made the comment about the pipeline going to Houston And there are refineries in Colorado and Wyoming

Yes the Canadian oil is from the sands and it is a dirty oil . Refineries are built to Refine certain oils through them. The refinery in Sinclair Wyoming is it's not made for the Canadian sands oil it Is the bigger refineries in Houston that are able to do that that is why the pipeline is to go down there yes some was going to be exported but some was going to Stay in the US.

There are many different crude oils throughout the United States the dakotas have a crude oil that is almost as clear as pure refined diesel fuel but then you go to Colorado and the crude oil there is black and heavy. Then you go to Texas and Louisiana and it is a whole another type of oil

I worked for a major oil company upstream Throughout the US and have seen many drilling operations And types of crude oil.

Replied on Fri, Oct 08, 2021 at 08:00 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "I think I replied to the wrong person. That comment was meant for someone talking about vaccines"

I think you are back pedaling. You literally addressed the pipeline entirely in your post, I'm the one that had the audacity to ask a question about the pipeline. And I'm going to ask the expert more questions. The experts of this world tell me that every financial situation that annoys me is "just supply and demand" it's just the way the economy works. Why doesn't that work in this case? If a pipeline is increasing the amount of oil (even if it's crappy oil) to be exported from the gulf, doesn't that increase the supply of "good oil" in the US?, therefore decreasing demand in the US? Next is logistics, so as you said, Canada doesn't want that oil. Where are Canada's refineries? I am genuinely asking because I don't know, if they are on the west coast, doest that make it a significantly longer ship route to the middle east than from the gulf? Pumping to a. Wyoming refinery seems rediculous because it's land locked. In my opinion a pipeline is 100 percent political, not environmental. As a trucker I don't want to get rid of work by advocating for a pipeline as you've said. I talked to a Canadian couple that team drove a crude tanker in 2017 in Carrington ND. Super nice people, taking crude from Canada to Texas, paid 4 dollars per loaded mile and they drove back to Canada empty. That's a dream gig back then. And in my opion dream gigs aren't sustainable long term because if it's THAT good that you love it, someone will find a way to cut that cost by rail or by pipe. I say a pipeline is political because a crude tanker on the highway or rail can wreck and spill and nobody in politics cares, but if that pipeline leaks....look out. Yeah you're right, pipelines put a bruise on wilderness and there's not much left, well, so do wind farms and solar panels on my beautiful prairie, but nobody cares because the climate change industrial complex makes the correct people rich, so it's ok. It's a super complicated issue made more complicated by people who aggressively shut down conversation about it. These are my opinions, thank God I'm not an expert but I enjoy learning about these topics. I also care about the environment and wilderness passionately because hunting is a huge part of my life, but I also am not willing to starve or price out of business the middle class in the name of being green. I could be 100 percent wrong on all of this, I don't have experience with sea ports or shipping, but I got to see what actually happened at a pipeline protest compared to what the tv said about a pipeline protest and that situation made me lose alot of respect for political leaders and media. Good luck, keep trucking, I'm heading to some northern Minnesota wilderness to go bear hunting before that wilderness is covered in windmills.
Replied on Fri, Oct 08, 2021 at 08:01 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "I have no clue what you're talking about. However this isn't a political issue. It's private business selling their product for what the market can bare. That's literally capitalism."

What is it called when the government releases oil from the strategic reserve intended for the military, on to the free market to suppress the prices?
Replied on Fri, Oct 08, 2021 at 08:01 AM CST
+ 1
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "You are 100% correct. I said it above. A pipeline to the west coast of Canada would be much shorter. But Canadians don't want to put their country in jeopardy. It's so odd to me that people are ok with a foreign company forcing Americans to put something on their land. Against their will. Nevermind the weirdness of truck drivers arguing in favor of a pipeline that puts truck drivers out of work. Hell every pipeline puts truck drivers out of work."

Most truckers sit and listen to talk radio all day, ( paid for by who?) and that has a lot to do with how they form their opinions.
Replied on Fri, Oct 08, 2021 at 10:56 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "I think you are back pedaling. You literally addressed the pipeline entirely in your post, I'm the one that had the audacity to ask a question about the pipeline. And I'm going to ask the expert more questions. The experts of this world tell me that every financial situation that annoys me is "just supply and demand" it's just the way the economy works. Why doesn't that work in this case? If a pipeline is increasing the amount of oil (even if it's crappy oil) to be exported from the gulf, doesn't that increase the supply of "good oil" in the US?, therefore decreasing demand in the US? Next is logistics, so as you said, Canada doesn't want that oil. Where are Canada's refineries? I am genuinely asking because I don't know, if they are on the west coast, doest that make it a significantly longer ship route to the middle east than from the gulf? Pumping to a. Wyoming refinery seems rediculous because it's land locked. In my opinion a pipeline is 100 percent political, not environmental. As a trucker I don't want to get rid of work by advocating for a pipeline as you've said. I talked to a Canadian couple that team drove a crude tanker in 2017 in Carrington ND. Super nice people, taking crude from Canada to Texas, paid 4 dollars per loaded mile and they drove back to Canada empty. That's a dream gig back then. And in my opion dream gigs aren't sustainable long term because if it's THAT good that you love it, someone will find a way to cut that cost by rail or by pipe. I say a pipeline is political because a crude tanker on the highway or rail can wreck and spill and nobody in politics cares, but if that pipeline leaks....look out. Yeah you're right, pipelines put a bruise on wilderness and there's not much left, well, so do wind farms and solar panels on my beautiful prairie, but nobody cares because the climate change industrial complex makes the correct people rich, so it's ok. It's a super complicated issue made more complicated by people who aggressively shut down conversation about it. These are my opinions, thank God I'm not an expert but I enjoy learning about these topics. I also care about the environment and wilderness passionately because hunting is a huge part of my life, but I also am not willing to starve or price out of business the middle class in the name of being green. I could be 100 percent wrong on all of this, I don't have experience with sea ports or shipping, but I got to see what actually happened at a pipeline protest compared to what the tv said about a pipeline protest and that situation made me lose alot of respect for political leaders and media. Good luck, keep trucking, I'm heading to some northern Minnesota wilderness to go bear hunting before that wilderness is covered in windmills."

I'm not back peddling on anything. There are 4 or 5 people asking me the same thing over and over. The short sweet simple answer is no. Here's an example. All oil isn't equal. Just like all trailers aren't. If there's an over saturation of hopper trailers but a high demand and low supply of pneumatic trailers, which one is going to cost more to hire? It's that simple. The oil industry has a product that everyone needs. If they meet demand they sell each unit for less than if the fall short. It's the only industry other than the pharmaceutical industry that is legally allowed to price fix. Of course it isn't called that when they do it. I keep telling you that your theory is wrong. If you want to believe incorrect information that's on you. If you want something to be outraged about that actually matters look into the wall street banks, billionaires and Chinese that are buying up Mississippi Delta farm land right now. In fact as we speak Bill Gates currently owns more US farmland than any other individual. Here's another one. Saudis are digging super deep water wells is AZ to grow hay for animals in Saudi Arabia. They drained ALL of their own aquifers in less than 30 years doing this. Now it's our turn.
Replied on Fri, Oct 08, 2021 at 10:56 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "To the gentleman that made the comment about the pipeline going to Houston And there are refineries in Colorado and Wyoming Yes the Canadian oil is from the sands and it is a dirty oil . Refineries are built to Refine certain oils through them. The refinery in Sinclair Wyoming is it's not made for the Canadian sands oil it Is the bigger refineries in Houston that are able to do that that is why the pipeline is to go down there yes some was going to be exported but some was going to Stay in the US. There are many different crude oils throughout the United States the dakotas have a crude oil that is almost as clear as pure refined diesel fuel but then you go to Colorado and the crude oil there is black and heavy. Then you go to Texas and Louisiana and it is a whole another type of oil I worked for a major oil company upstream Throughout the US and have seen many drilling operations And types of crude oil. "

My original point is that refineries can be retrofitted to refine any oil. Several in Houston were retrofitted during the Bush years to handle the nasty stuff. The Canada sands oil will be exported. So it won't have any effect on prices in the states. Canadians have ocean access on 3 sides. It would be less distance to the ocean in Canada. But Canadians don't want oil pipelines across sensitive areas. Our country is always for sale. As long as you buy a few politicians and talking heads on TV and radio.
Replied on Sun, Oct 10, 2021 at 07:47 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "I'm not back peddling on anything. There are 4 or 5 people asking me the same thing over and over. The short sweet simple answer is no. Here's an example. All oil isn't equal. Just like all trailers aren't. If there's an over saturation of hopper trailers but a high demand and low supply of pneumatic trailers, which one is going to cost more to hire? It's that simple. The oil industry has a product that everyone needs. If they meet demand they sell each unit for less than if the fall short. It's the only industry other than the pharmaceutical industry that is legally allowed to price fix. Of course it isn't called that when they do it. I keep telling you that your theory is wrong. If you want to believe incorrect information that's on you. If you want something to be outraged about that actually matters look into the wall street banks, billionaires and Chinese that are buying up Mississippi Delta farm land right now. In fact as we speak Bill Gates currently owns more US farmland than any other individual. Here's another one. Saudis are digging super deep water wells is AZ to grow hay for animals in Saudi Arabia. They drained ALL of their own aquifers in less than 30 years doing this. Now it's our turn."

Nobody here is outraged. Except you at differing opinions and questions. Maybe I'm misinterpreting your tone because it's the internet and not face to face. But you seem genuinely annoyed that people disagree with you. So here's more questions. You keep mentioning that the US is always for sale and Canada protects it's sensitive areas. First of all, what is considered a sensitive area? Second, what is Canada's population compared to the US population, and Canadian square miles of land compared to the US? Seems to me that wilderness land is much more easily protected where there are less people because there are less mouths to feed financially speaking. Do you consider people who sell out land for wind towers on an equal plane as people who sell out for a pipeline? Also, are Canadian ports as equally productive in cold seasons as they are in warm seasons? That's pretty far north, I'm just curious if that plays a factor? I'm not trying to be a smart Alec. I'm just trying to understand the situation. I'd prefer to see wilderness protected, but I don't view everyone involved in a pipeline as morally inferior. Again, I could be 100 percent wrong, but it seems to me that the pipeline going where it did happened because it was cost effective for those involved. I never trust emotional data , or political data for that matter. So maybe the pipeline is 100 percent irrelevant. Well, what party forced the country to shut down because they deemed most of us non essential? Didn't that create a supply chain nightmare? What would fuel prices be if we never forced people to shut the country down? Just asking, not looking for a fight
Replied on Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 08:52 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "You are 100% correct. I said it above. A pipeline to the west coast of Canada would be much shorter. But Canadians don't want to put their country in jeopardy. It's so odd to me that people are ok with a foreign company forcing Americans to put something on their land. Against their will. Nevermind the weirdness of truck drivers arguing in favor of a pipeline that puts truck drivers out of work. Hell every pipeline puts truck drivers out of work."

A pipeline across the Rockies would be a nightmare.
Replied on Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 09:13 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "My original point is that refineries can be retrofitted to refine any oil. Several in Houston were retrofitted during the Bush years to handle the nasty stuff. The Canada sands oil will be exported. So it won't have any effect on prices in the states. Canadians have ocean access on 3 sides. It would be less distance to the ocean in Canada. But Canadians don't want oil pipelines across sensitive areas. Our country is always for sale. As long as you buy a few politicians and talking heads on TV and radio."

Oil is a world wide commodity. All markets have an effect on all other markets.
Replied on Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 09:13 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "A pipeline across the Rockies would be a nightmare."

I agree. And I think some of the eastern ports freeze over don't they?
Replied on Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 09:44 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "I agree. And I think some of the eastern ports freeze over don't they?"

I would think so. Weather certainly is a factor. Also freight going out of the west coast goes to different places than freight out of the gulf. The market you serve is what dictates where you ship from.
Replied on Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 12:51 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Nobody here is outraged. Except you at differing opinions and questions. Maybe I'm misinterpreting your tone because it's the internet and not face to face. But you seem genuinely annoyed that people disagree with you. So here's more questions. You keep mentioning that the US is always for sale and Canada protects it's sensitive areas. First of all, what is considered a sensitive area? Second, what is Canada's population compared to the US population, and Canadian square miles of land compared to the US? Seems to me that wilderness land is much more easily protected where there are less people because there are less mouths to feed financially speaking. Do you consider people who sell out land for wind towers on an equal plane as people who sell out for a pipeline? Also, are Canadian ports as equally productive in cold seasons as they are in warm seasons? That's pretty far north, I'm just curious if that plays a factor? I'm not trying to be a smart Alec. I'm just trying to understand the situation. I'd prefer to see wilderness protected, but I don't view everyone involved in a pipeline as morally inferior. Again, I could be 100 percent wrong, but it seems to me that the pipeline going where it did happened because it was cost effective for those involved. I never trust emotional data , or political data for that matter. So maybe the pipeline is 100 percent irrelevant. Well, what party forced the country to shut down because they deemed most of us non essential? Didn't that create a supply chain nightmare? What would fuel prices be if we never forced people to shut the country down? Just asking, not looking for a fight"

Tone is a sound. Since it's words on a screen any tone you are picking up on are coming from you.
Replied on Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 12:55 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "A pipeline across the Rockies would be a nightmare."

And? It's been done before. (Trans Mountain pipeline) Like I said before, Canadians said hell no. So they bought some American politicians and some talking heads to keep Americans outraged about a nothing burger. Pipelines no matter the commodity put truck drivers out of work. So truck drivers pushing for a pipeline is just bizarre.
Replied on Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 02:10 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Oil is a world wide commodity. All markets have an effect on all other markets."

Are you aware that the world uses 98 million barrels of oil per day? Under best case scenarios that pipeline would move about 700,000 barrels per day. That isn't even 1% The price of oil isn't really controlled by supply and demand like most things. Because they simply produce less to drive the prices up. That's the whole purpose of OPEC. The oil industry lost it's azz last year. They are simply recouping losses. It sucks for us but it's exactly what I would do. You would too. Price fixing in the Energy and pharmaceutical industries are allowed.
Replied on Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 02:10 PM CST
+ 1
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "And? It's been done before. (Trans Mountain pipeline) Like I said before, Canadians said hell no. So they bought some American politicians and some talking heads to keep Americans outraged about a nothing burger. Pipelines no matter the commodity put truck drivers out of work. So truck drivers pushing for a pipeline is just bizarre."

Who here said the words "we want a pipeline"? We are merely discussing the consequences of disrupting a supply chain. From the research I've done, some eastern Canadian ports can freeze. That eliminates consistency with a pipeline taking oil to an east coast Canadian port right? West coast is our of the question because it's double the distance to the middle east right? Where's the next logical port with gauranteed year round ship access plus a downhill advantage after the continental divide? That gives me the impression shutting down the pipeline was more political than environmental, or even emotional. Biden admin shuts down trans Canada....then helps get a pipeline going from Russia to Germany right?
Replied on Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 02:10 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "I forgot to address the pipeline. If you're talking about the one from Canada, it's a complete scam. I'll explain I know for a fact that there are oil refineries in WY and CO. Nevermind the 17 oil refineries IN CANADA! So why would a company pump oil thousands of miles and bypass several closer refineries? I'll answer. The crude comes from oil sands. That's why. It's dirty nasty oil. They want to pump it to Houston so it can be put on a ship and sent overseas. Because it can't be used over here for environmental reasons. Why doesn't Canada pump it to THEIR west coast and put it on a ship? Canadians care about their wilderness areas and blocked it. So the next best thing is to jeopardize the US. Because we're always for sale. Regardless of risk and consequences. The whole damn world knows this. That's why China is currently buying up US farmland like crazy. It's why the Saudis pumped all of their aquifers (underground lakes) dry grows hay for animals. But are now doing the same thing in AZ. Without any oversight or regulation. They dig the well and can take as much water as they like. The farms look like prisons with armed guards and everything. But by all means continue to worry about the important stuff, other people's money."

Well being from ND and having a home not far from the pipeline protesters (Water somethings) I can tell you first hand that the protesters did more damage and left more garbage than this pipeline will cause if it is allowed to run and not be tampered with. People have a vision of making themselves more important than they are. Pipeline protesters, IE Celebrities, and various out of state, tree hugging factions, fly in on their private jets (fossil fuel powered) get driven around by gas gussling limo's (fossil fuel powered) and vandilize private property, dumping oil and painting on the ground in the name of saving the water?! Get real! The biggest harm being caused today is due to "Do gooder activists" with their "my poo doesn't stink" attitudes and do as I say, not as I do stances on the climate and what is best for the world. We had smoke from wild fires for a month straight! What causes wild fires? Dry, dead trees because of over growth of the forest and not letting new growth arrise. I blame this on the tree huggers who think that maintaining forest integrity is a bad thing. At certain points, old trees need to be taken down so new ones can grow and not be starved of sunlight. It is simple, common sense, but if you have no knowledge of where things come from, IE lumber comes from trees, Milk from a cow, gas from oil, you will be oblivious to the manner in which your daily life evolves!

It is time to get the younger generation off of their dead asses, off their Ipads and Xboxes and out into nature! Out learning what this amazing planet has to offer and how when a catastrophy happens, the earth heals itself! Nature is bigger than anyone person, any one group and much bigger than a bunch of egg head celelbrities wanting to make themselves feel important and sure as hell bigger than 437 bonehead polliticians and hundreds of thousands of lobbyist in Washington!

You want to make a difference? Teach a kid to make change, how to fish, how to hunt, how to rely on themselves and not anyone else. If we can get away from constantly being on computers and electronics and talk to each other, we will be amazed at what is actually happening in this world rather than taking the word of figure heads and the press.

Rant over. Good luck and God Bless!

Keith

ET Trucking
Replied on Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 03:39 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Well being from ND and having a home not far from the pipeline protesters (Water somethings) I can tell you first hand that the protesters did more damage and left more garbage than this pipeline will cause if it is allowed to run and not be tampered with. People have a vision of making themselves more important than they are. Pipeline protesters, IE Celebrities, and various out of state, tree hugging factions, fly in on their private jets (fossil fuel powered) get driven around by gas gussling limo's (fossil fuel powered) and vandilize private property, dumping oil and painting on the ground in the name of saving the water?! Get real! The biggest harm being caused today is due to "Do gooder activists" with their "my poo doesn't stink" attitudes and do as I say, not as I do stances on the climate and what is best for the world. We had smoke from wild fires for a month straight! What causes wild fires? Dry, dead trees because of over growth of the forest and not letting new growth arrise. I blame this on the tree huggers who think that maintaining forest integrity is a bad thing. At certain points, old trees need to be taken down so new ones can grow and not be starved of sunlight. It is simple, common sense, but if you have no knowledge of where things come from, IE lumber comes from trees, Milk from a cow, gas from oil, you will be oblivious to the manner in which your daily life evolves! It is time to get the younger generation off of their dead asses, off their Ipads and Xboxes and out into nature! Out learning what this amazing planet has to offer and how when a catastrophy happens, the earth heals itself! Nature is bigger than anyone person, any one group and much bigger than a bunch of egg head celelbrities wanting to make themselves feel important and sure as hell bigger than 437 bonehead polliticians and hundreds of thousands of lobbyist in Washington! You want to make a difference? Teach a kid to make change, how to fish, how to hunt, how to rely on themselves and not anyone else. If we can get away from constantly being on computers and electronics and talk to each other, we will be amazed at what is actually happening in this world rather than taking the word of figure heads and the press. Rant over. Good luck and God Bless! Keith ET Trucking"

Well said, but I doubt any of it got through. Irving may as well be a suburb of San Francisco. All I would have added was, MIKE DROP at the very end. 😎
Replied on Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 07:42 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Are you aware that the world uses 98 million barrels of oil per day? Under best case scenarios that pipeline would move about 700,000 barrels per day. That isn't even 1% The price of oil isn't really controlled by supply and demand like most things. Because they simply produce less to drive the prices up. That's the whole purpose of OPEC. The oil industry lost it's azz last year. They are simply recouping losses. It sucks for us but it's exactly what I would do. You would too. Price fixing in the Energy and pharmaceutical industries are allowed."

1% is quite significant. The effects this administration has had on fuel isn't even debatable anymore. The anti Petroleum stance has already proven itself. The truth behind this is that any harm that can be done is used to justify more regulation. They will run up prices until people beg them for relief. You literally need to be blind not to see it. There isn't one thing being done by this administration that doesn't harm working class Americans. The same level of stupidity applied to withdrawal from Afghanistan and the southern border is being applied to the economy and resources management. They are stupid for doing what they are but not doing it because they're stupid.
Replied on Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 08:27 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "1% is quite significant. The effects this administration has had on fuel isn't even debatable anymore. The anti Petroleum stance has already proven itself. The truth behind this is that any harm that can be done is used to justify more regulation. They will run up prices until people beg them for relief. You literally need to be blind not to see it. There isn't one thing being done by this administration that doesn't harm working class Americans. The same level of stupidity applied to withdrawal from Afghanistan and the southern border is being applied to the economy and resources management. They are stupid for doing what they are but not doing it because they're stupid."

Also, well said. Maybe Irving isn't so bad after all. 🤠
Replied on Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 08:40 AM CST
+ 1
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "BIDEN"

I'm surprised this thread has gone on so long without someone blaming the brokers and dispatchers..😂😂😂
Replied on Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 10:17 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "And? It's been done before. (Trans Mountain pipeline) Like I said before, Canadians said hell no. So they bought some American politicians and some talking heads to keep Americans outraged about a nothing burger. Pipelines no matter the commodity put truck drivers out of work. So truck drivers pushing for a pipeline is just bizarre."

Let’s focus on that word bizarre for a moment, everyone criticize’s media all the time for not telling the truth weather it’s social media like Facebook or the 6:00 pm news, yet the same folks who criticize media are basing their opinions on what the media told them? How bizarre is that? Radio, TV, Facebook what’s the difference? It’s all controlled and censored by the elite, the only source of information the government doesn’t control is the oijia board.
Replied on Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 12:18 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "1% is quite significant. The effects this administration has had on fuel isn't even debatable anymore. The anti Petroleum stance has already proven itself. The truth behind this is that any harm that can be done is used to justify more regulation. They will run up prices until people beg them for relief. You literally need to be blind not to see it. There isn't one thing being done by this administration that doesn't harm working class Americans. The same level of stupidity applied to withdrawal from Afghanistan and the southern border is being applied to the economy and resources management. They are stupid for doing what they are but not doing it because they're stupid."

1% isn't significant because it's 1%. The previous administration signed a deal and agreed to leave. But buy all means ignore that. However getting out of that country was the right thing to do. Especially considering how fast their "military" folded it's tents. You all keep blaming politicians for what private business chose to do. So give me 3 SPECIFIC things this administration has done to drive up cost. You can't use that scam pipeline. Because it's years from completion. So it isn't changing anything.
Replied on Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 12:18 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Let’s focus on that word bizarre for a moment, everyone criticize’s media all the time for not telling the truth weather it’s social media like Facebook or the 6:00 pm news, yet the same folks who criticize media are basing their opinions on what the media told them? How bizarre is that? Radio, TV, Facebook what’s the difference? It’s all controlled and censored by the elite, the only source of information the government doesn’t control is the oijia board."

You're all over the place. Goodness gracious.
Replied on Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 12:18 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Who here said the words "we want a pipeline"? We are merely discussing the consequences of disrupting a supply chain. From the research I've done, some eastern Canadian ports can freeze. That eliminates consistency with a pipeline taking oil to an east coast Canadian port right? West coast is our of the question because it's double the distance to the middle east right? Where's the next logical port with gauranteed year round ship access plus a downhill advantage after the continental divide? That gives me the impression shutting down the pipeline was more political than environmental, or even emotional. Biden admin shuts down trans Canada....then helps get a pipeline going from Russia to Germany right?"

My guy there's ALREADY a Canadian oil pipeline to the west. I told you that above. It's about ¼ the length of one going to Houston. It's called the Trans Mountain pipeline. (For the second time)
Replied on Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 12:19 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Well being from ND and having a home not far from the pipeline protesters (Water somethings) I can tell you first hand that the protesters did more damage and left more garbage than this pipeline will cause if it is allowed to run and not be tampered with. People have a vision of making themselves more important than they are. Pipeline protesters, IE Celebrities, and various out of state, tree hugging factions, fly in on their private jets (fossil fuel powered) get driven around by gas gussling limo's (fossil fuel powered) and vandilize private property, dumping oil and painting on the ground in the name of saving the water?! Get real! The biggest harm being caused today is due to "Do gooder activists" with their "my poo doesn't stink" attitudes and do as I say, not as I do stances on the climate and what is best for the world. We had smoke from wild fires for a month straight! What causes wild fires? Dry, dead trees because of over growth of the forest and not letting new growth arrise. I blame this on the tree huggers who think that maintaining forest integrity is a bad thing. At certain points, old trees need to be taken down so new ones can grow and not be starved of sunlight. It is simple, common sense, but if you have no knowledge of where things come from, IE lumber comes from trees, Milk from a cow, gas from oil, you will be oblivious to the manner in which your daily life evolves! It is time to get the younger generation off of their dead asses, off their Ipads and Xboxes and out into nature! Out learning what this amazing planet has to offer and how when a catastrophy happens, the earth heals itself! Nature is bigger than anyone person, any one group and much bigger than a bunch of egg head celelbrities wanting to make themselves feel important and sure as hell bigger than 437 bonehead polliticians and hundreds of thousands of lobbyist in Washington! You want to make a difference? Teach a kid to make change, how to fish, how to hunt, how to rely on themselves and not anyone else. If we can get away from constantly being on computers and electronics and talk to each other, we will be amazed at what is actually happening in this world rather than taking the word of figure heads and the press. Rant over. Good luck and God Bless! Keith ET Trucking"

Trash can be picked up with oh.....say......your hands. Oil spills can not. You all are ok with a foreign corporation coming onto American soil and forcing American landowners to accept something on THEIR property that they don't want? Well this guy will never be ok with that.
Replied on Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 02:35 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "You're all over the place. Goodness gracious."

My point was that often times people’s opinions are not based on fact, as much as they are propaganda that was perceived to be fact, if you somehow missed that. Not trying to cause you grief
Replied on Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 02:51 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "My guy there's ALREADY a Canadian oil pipeline to the west. I told you that above. It's about ¼ the length of one going to Houston. It's called the Trans Mountain pipeline. (For the second time)"

Respectfully, I never denied the existence of that pipeline. I questioned the cost effective legitimacy of a ship going from the west coast to the middle east. At this point our discussion should be done because you've ventured into a territory of emotions over facts. Example. Fact number 1, 10000 people couldn't pick up the trash from the dapl protest in 10 years. That was done with payloaders , end dumps and garbage trucks and it took weeks. Second. The standing rock sioux tribe wanted the pipeline on their land. They agreed to it. They asked for more money after the fact and dapl said get bent....begin protest. Begin violence. Begin accosting anybody in the area that has the audacity to have a decenting opinion, big rich college kids that showed up by the thousands screaming for something they knew nothing about. Did CNN not tell you that?
Replied on Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 09:01 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "1% isn't significant because it's 1%. The previous administration signed a deal and agreed to leave. But buy all means ignore that. However getting out of that country was the right thing to do. Especially considering how fast their "military" folded it's tents. You all keep blaming politicians for what private business chose to do. So give me 3 SPECIFIC things this administration has done to drive up cost. You can't use that scam pipeline. Because it's years from completion. So it isn't changing anything."

"Biden Opens New Fronts In His War On U.S. Oil And Gas" https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidblackmon/2021/01/28/biden-opens-new-fronts-in-his-war-on-us-oil-and-gas/amp/
Replied on Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 09:01 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "My guy there's ALREADY a Canadian oil pipeline to the west. I told you that above. It's about ¼ the length of one going to Houston. It's called the Trans Mountain pipeline. (For the second time)"

It doesn't do any good to send oil west if it's being sold in the East. You ship from the port that services the desired market. You don't seem real in tune with logistics. BTW what makes train and truck oil spill less harmful than pipeline spills
Replied on Wed, Oct 13, 2021 at 07:42 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Excellent research David. My question is where is the price of fuel today compared to the Trump years. I am not the biggest fan of Trump but i seem to remember that my fuel bill was not as far out of control back then as it started to be 6 weeks or so after Biden took office."

Did he hurt your feelings with mean tweets
Replied on Wed, Oct 13, 2021 at 08:00 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.

You bet Randy. I learned from you. Cower in total fear in the basement with my emotional support gerbil and my coloring book. Thanks for the advice on where to find the best coloring book.
Replied on Wed, Oct 13, 2021 at 04:07 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Trash can be picked up with oh.....say......your hands. Oil spills can not. You all are ok with a foreign corporation coming onto American soil and forcing American landowners to accept something on THEIR property that they don't want? Well this guy will never be ok with that."

YES, trash can be picked up! But why would ANYONE with an adgenda of "Water Protectors" leave a bigger mess than they need to? Simple answer, spoiled little entitled brats who think it's a game! I guess I will take my chances on a new pipeline with new technology than an old outdated pipeline. I have seen first hand the mess made by these activists! Also our company is out of Casselton ND. Google it and see what the town is famous for! Would you like this type of stuff coming through your town or would you rather have it pushed along through a pipeline that has constant monitoring?!

Replied on Wed, Oct 13, 2021 at 04:15 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "Respectfully, I never denied the existence of that pipeline. I questioned the cost effective legitimacy of a ship going from the west coast to the middle east. At this point our discussion should be done because you've ventured into a territory of emotions over facts. Example. Fact number 1, 10000 people couldn't pick up the trash from the dapl protest in 10 years. That was done with payloaders , end dumps and garbage trucks and it took weeks. Second. The standing rock sioux tribe wanted the pipeline on their land. They agreed to it. They asked for more money after the fact and dapl said get bent....begin protest. Begin violence. Begin accosting anybody in the area that has the audacity to have a decenting opinion, big rich college kids that showed up by the thousands screaming for something they knew nothing about. Did CNN not tell you that?"

You are right about DAPL but it was not 10 years ago, it was 5 years ago. The thing about this is that they had to break this protest up and shut the camps down in order to clean up the mess before the spring thaw. Had they not done this when they did, the Missouri river would have been filled with thousands of tons of debris left behind by people who can't pick up after themselves! It was shameful!

Now my next question is where does oil come from? It comes out of the ground. Mother earth created it and in a spill situation she will filter the water to take the polutants out of the water! She has been doing that for millions of years and will continue to do it long after you, me, or any of our decendants are long gone! Man has the superiority complex of thinking that we know what's best for the earth, but mother nature will ALWAYS show you who is boss! These so called experts, IE Al Gore, the man who flew private jets to global climate summits, and all the rest of these protesters who can't get by without fossil fuels, need to take a step back and see how their lives are affected by oil!
Replied on Wed, Oct 13, 2021 at 04:53 PM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "You are right about DAPL but it was not 10 years ago, it was 5 years ago. The thing about this is that they had to break this protest up and shut the camps down in order to clean up the mess before the spring thaw. Had they not done this when they did, the Missouri river would have been filled with thousands of tons of debris left behind by people who can't pick up after themselves! It was shameful! Now my next question is where does oil come from? It comes out of the ground. Mother earth created it and in a spill situation she will filter the water to take the polutants out of the water! She has been doing that for millions of years and will continue to do it long after you, me, or any of our decendants are long gone! Man has the superiority complex of thinking that we know what's best for the earth, but mother nature will ALWAYS show you who is boss! These so called experts, IE Al Gore, the man who flew private jets to global climate summits, and all the rest of these protesters who can't get by without fossil fuels, need to take a step back and see how their lives are affected by oil!"

You are 125 percent correct. I used my words wrong. I didn't mean that it happened 10 years ago. I meant it would take 10 years to clean it up by hand. I saw the pictures. That was an epic mess. I'm proud of living in the Dakotas. It's beautiful land and full of awesome people, and plenty of the standing rock members were great about how they handled it. The problems were the college kids. This land should be protected... and yep, people conveniently leave out a crude oil train derailment or a truck crash that spills 8000 gallons. And it seems to me a pipeline oil spill is always held to a higher standard for cleanup than a train derailment as well but that's just my opinion
Replied on Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 09:56 AM CST
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Posted by a private BulkLoads.com member.
Quote: "You are 125 percent correct. I used my words wrong. I didn't mean that it happened 10 years ago. I meant it would take 10 years to clean it up by hand. I saw the pictures. That was an epic mess. I'm proud of living in the Dakotas. It's beautiful land and full of awesome people, and plenty of the standing rock members were great about how they handled it. The problems were the college kids. This land should be protected... and yep, people conveniently leave out a crude oil train derailment or a truck crash that spills 8000 gallons. And it seems to me a pipeline oil spill is always held to a higher standard for cleanup than a train derailment as well but that's just my opinion"

In Mahnomen county Mn, at the junction of MN hwy 113 and county road 4, the Water protectors had a camp set up. They were there for about a year and then just picked up and left EVERYTHING! It was a mess of epic proportions! The sherriff of the county ended up cleaning up the land. Rumor has it that he bought the land because he could not stand the sight of the mess. If we are to take these people seriously, why would they not be good stuards of the land they occupy while trying to make a point?! The answer is that they don't really believe in their own cause and most likely are paid to protest! We saw this in the George Floyd riots and we see it in other protests too! Anywhere there is an adgenda there will be paid protestors! I, for one, am sick of the way this country is moving! The good, honest, hard working people of this country are being overtaken by a generation of spoiled, entitled brats who think because someone in accademia has told them something and they have been indoctrinated since grade school, then it makes them an expert! All I can say is that we have not seen anything yet! If you thing fossil fuel is going to go away, I think you are dreaming! Electric vehicles will not be the answer!
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